1st Unique BRITISH Golf Clubs for 30years Launching 28th Oct 2011

EMBARGOED Till October 29th, 2011.

Jack Golf tees off as Brits fight back

THE Brits are fighting back with the launch of a revolutionary golf club that is set to turn the sport into the new Formula One.

For 30 years almost all the golf clubs in the world have come from China but the launch of ‘Jack Golf’ will be the first of a new generation of high technology clubs manufactured in the UK.

The quiet Warwickshire Village of Studley is an unlikely location for this revolution but it is the home of one of the world’s leading club designers who is using techniques learned from the automotive industry.

Golf Alchemy Ltd is now launching a new wedge made from high quality materials that is promising to turn to world of golf on its head and become a must in the bags of the world’s top professional players as well as millions of amateur golfers.

The clubs are wholly manufactured in the West Midlands using high quality materials, state of the art precision machining and hand finished craftsmanship.

In Tests of over 1000+ hits. The Clubs Showed Minimal Loss of Spin rates!

The brand will be sold and distributed through the network of golf shops run by the PGA professionals trained and equipped to look after the clubs.

For more information about ‘Jack Golf’ visit:

http://www.jackgolf.co.uk  (Live on 28th Oct 2011)

at all?

I'm with you there Ivan.  It appears to be all too simple to baffle some of the less technical people with cod technology and marketing buzz words and, unfortunately Paul, the OP does tend to stray into that territory.  Throwing in sound bites about automotive technology, high quality materials etc: actually means very little without some technical information to back it up.  There is, unfortunately, a tendency to get a bit parochial about equipment that is made in China - but the unfortunate truth is that they are more than capable of making extremely high quality equipment at very competitive prices and the fact that 90% of golf equipment is manufactured there bears this out.

As a design engineer I'd appreciate some sort of expansion on the claims you've made, if you like you can pm me and I could let you have a private e-mail address.

Paul , I'm assuming these wedges are cast? not forged ? what materials are you using? very interested as I am a High end Japanese user and collector and quality is aways my first criteria.

Dave 

still looks like a reformed pork based product to me, sorry

All I can say is I hope you aren't the press officer Paul...

Apart from a tenuous grasp of basic english some of us will be busy on the 28th at the Golfshake Open. 

You having a drink with me Thursday Tim?http://www.golfshake.com/scripts/ckeditor/plugins/smiley/images/wink_smile.gif" title="wink" width="20" />

Hope , its worth the wait Paul, and we shall give you our verdict  http://www.golfshake.com/scripts/ckeditor/plugins/smiley/images/thumbs_up.gif" title="yes" width="20" />http://www.golfshake.com/scripts/ckeditor/plugins/smiley/images/thumbs_down.gif" title="no" width="20" />    http://www.golfshake.com/scripts/ckeditor/plugins/smiley/images/regular_smile.gif" title="smiley" width="20" />

Nah, will be coming down in the morning Dave, only 45 minutes from here.  This'll do

I think you've hit the nail on the head there Ivan.  What's the point of paying to promote a product  when there's a great captive audience here?  A bunch of real golf enthusiasts who buy equipment in the real world - not only that a nationwide audience that gathers at quite regular intervals.  The problem with producing a world beater is that is it only achieves that if the world knows about it.  Start from the grass roots, pandering to the professionals means you have to take on the big names and no-one can do that without stellar budgets... 

I suggest that Paul (or one of his colleagues) brings a sample to the Golfshake open.  That way he can get some honest opinion from some keen amateur golfers of a range of age, ability and handicap. 

• Jack Golf will have some independent consumer feedback (and probably some great quotes) ready for their product launch
• The golfers who try the product may be tempted to part with some hard earned cash if the product is as good as the story says
• Darren can use the opportunity to promote his site as the sounding board for the this great new product

Everyone's a winner in this situation

Just as a further thought, perhaps Jack Golf could donate a wedge as a prize for the first placed golfer at the Golfshake Open

• Lots of kudos for supporting grass roots golf
• Immediate good name for the company
• We all know how Darren and Adam love to write up reviews for their sponsors and partners - lots of free press on a site with a large number of users

Just think of the publicity  "Golfshake Open winner receives Jack Golf wedge...before it's released!!!"  And after the participants have tried the wedge out before the match there will be lots of quotes about how jealous they are that they didn't win it.

PS I won't win it so there is nothing in this for me!!!

23 hours longer than the Chinese would need Ivan

 in order to get the drawings prepared and faxed over to the Japanese

you crack me up sometimes, Ivan

Sorry Tim, but this is part of the problem I have with claims made in articles such as this.  I will probabaly go into a bit more detail about your post when I have a little more time, but at the risk of being labelled pedantic you state in your 'facts' that  "They are 4 times forged to make the steel more dense for spin".   Surely your materials man knows that this is a ridiculous claim.  It's true that the material will be slightly denser (but by only fractions of a percent) compared to cast because of the reduction in the impurity inclusions, but the only advantage of forging is to increase the strength by controlling the grain flow.  This isn't high powered engineering, it's basic materials science.

More questions to follow.

I'm intrigued and can't wait to see and try . I'm all for Bitish engineering and manufacture so good luck and hope all the hype can deliver. I'm anal with wedges and only play top end forged Jap stuff(Chikera,Epon,Muira,scratch) something cleveland has responded to and are now forging thier legendary 588 , this must surely be through demand or why else. My chikera's have been my gamers for four years and have no problem with thier spin rate. I can relate to the coating issue as this tends to wear extremely quickly given the abuse a wedge takes , so this may/will appeal to the masses.For me I quite like the wear and aged look as a preference, but looking fresh wouldn't bother me if the wedges had great feel and funtioned well.

Paul and Tim can you comment on what feed back you have had regarding feel?

Dave

I think you're right with that last definition Ivan.

This thread has been an interesting one as new posters writing barely literate posts are often treated with derision on here, but not this one.

Obviously, we'll have to wait and see whether this is genuine, but my feeling is Ian H's post may be correct.

Having said that, as Paul says, "they're the EXPECTS", so who knows?

Sanders another word similar is pedantic.

Why thank you Ivan and I may just do that, and I'm only to pleased to have increased your vocabulary by one, in return for the many you have increased mine/others from your posts.

Having played and watched this game for many a year I have come to the conclusiohn that spin is vastly overated when it comes to wedges, Why? well. we have all witnessed the magical spin back the pro's manage to produce but the majority of times they would be nearer the flag if they had not produced this backspin.

Backspin of that nature is something I have never sought or wanted and I used to be able to play a bit.

I have never owned specialist wedges, always been content with the ones that match the set that I am playing with.

I might add that for £129 I would expect a degree of accuracy that I am not capable of.

Of course they will sell, as there are many who believe the hype of the modern day manufacturers, yet I have owned and passed on clubs that are almost thirty years old and play far better than the modern rubbish.

Most club components are made in China, a lot are assembled there as well but because of interesting US trade agreements a lot are assembled in Mexico.  Grips can be put on in the US to comply with 'made in the USA' designation.  Made in China does not mean inferior quality as I stated before, they are quality controlled from the manufacturers, it's just the labour costs and the volume they produce that make it an attractive proposition (see also my endless rants about fake and counterfeit clubs).

Andrew, your Mizunos will have been made in China nd they will go rusty because 1025 is a medium carbon steel, not stainless.  It will be the coating/plating that is cracking.  It is an ideal material to make clubs out of as it's easily workable and relatively cheap.  My irons are made from stainless (a grade called maraging) and it will not corode or crack, but (and it;'s quite a big but) it's relatively soft (about the same as untreated 1025 - the coating makes the club hard).  This means that it scratches very easily.   However one way round this is to heat treat it, but then you start getting all sorts of hydrogen embrittlement problems.

More later - tea time!

Andrew, Union Jack, but i like your thinkinghttp://www.golfshake.com/scripts/ckeditor/plugins/smiley/images/wink_smile.gif" title="wink" width="20" />

Pedantry point

It's only a Union Jack if it's flown from a ship, otherwise it should be called the Union Flag.

Andrew

1025 steel is cerainly not recycled rubbish, it's just a designation (ANSI or AISI) of i's chemical coposition and determines what it is good for.  So for 1025 it contains between 0.22 - 0.28% Carbon (to make it a steel), 0.30 - 0.60% Manganese (for toughness) and 0.04% Phosphurus and 0.05% Sulphur (for binding strength).  The rest is Iron, which is why it's susceptable to corrosion.  It's a good cold working steel and can be easily post manufacture heat treated to increase ductility and hardness. 

Andrew what internet browser are you using or even a smartphone ?

the dup posting was a known issue in the past but should have been fixed and now only occurs if you submit a post and then hit refresh.

Andrew Smith said

well speaking from experience if your good enough you can us anything.

That statement alone is contradictory to your thinking that this new wedge will make any difference to your game.

Who are you, Andrew, claiming 2.5 yet no profile to confirm this. Can you really play? or are you a fantasist.

Hit a sore nerve have we, Andrew, just another bullsh****r.

So you really think you are a good player, do you, well why not pop up from Kent to Berkshire and put your money where your mouth is.

Andrew,

Firstly, Tim is a degree qualified professional engineer with extensive aerospace design experience.  He is in a very strong position to make the statements he has made.  As an engineer with an MSc in automotive engineering with experience in metalurgy and specialist materials, I can confirm that his technical statements are completely correct.  I also suggest that you read properly as Tim stated that 1025 is a cheap standard grade material, not a high quality one.  Finally, ask anyone who has met Tim and they will tell you he is excellent company.  They would also tell you that Tim ridicules the "the bulls**t these golf companies churn out every year" as marketing rubbish every time a new claim is made.  As regards "preaching", he has just stated cold hard facts, nothing else.  You are the one preaching

As you are obviously new to the site (as pointed out by the comments made by John above, your lack of profile and a few other little items), you are obviously unaware of the Acceptable Use Policy of this forum and that your post is in contravention of it.  I suggest you read it prior to making any more posts or they run the risk of being removed

MR FRANCE - As pointed out earlier in the thread, posts like yours are usually treated as spam and removed.  You have been afforded the benefit of the doubt.  If you are going to make a post claiming great things, expect to be asked questions.  You have shared little so the questions will continue.  I understand the marketing ploy, but if you are going to use it expect the reaction you have got.  As regards your "at least you do KNOW what you are talking about" comment, you underestimate the expertise on this site (ex-pro's, current pro's, ex-county golfers, club builders, etc).  Marketing 101 - Know your audience

PS - If you are going to get your friends/colleagues/family/other personality to create an account to stick up for you, I suggest making it less obvious and advising them not to be disrespectful to long-standing members and potential customers

Not a high horse at all, Andrew just my views on the subject, to which I am entitled.

What amazes me is that you are condemning all the bullsh*t from all the current manufacturers yet are blind in your faith of a product that has not yet reached the market. Amazing really.

I have no need to buy one of these expensive wedges as mine do the job admirably. I am not obsessed with spin as it serves no useful purpose, especially when it cannot be controlled. Even the pro 's cannot control it.

Well done Chris - about time.

No-one has rubbished Jack Golf or their product.  Indeed, many have stated a desire to see and try it.  Questions have been asked and due to the marketing plan they have not been answered.  This leads to more questions and, due to human nature, suspicion. 

Golfshake has it's end of season competition on the date of the launch where several of the members postinf on this thread will be attending.  It was suggested that this could be used as a marketing and publicity opportunity.  They have failed to either decline or accept

Well I wasn't expecting that Andrew, your post certainly put me in my place.  To be honest I simply can't be bothered to respond to your ranting reply to my perfectly reasonable explanation of the materials used or the economics of Chinese manufacturing - you obviously can't or don't want to understand the situation as it currently is.

Nothing would give me greater pleasure than to see a UK company succeed in this market, but unless the product is truly revolutionary it will only ever be able to satisfy a niche market - much the same as Dave Leys beloved Japanese exotica.  These I can appreciate as technically and aesthetically beautiful although I would never be able to make any claims to be able to use them.   I don't believe that there is the scope to make such a radically different product which is why I was very interested to see if I could get some insight into just exactly what the technical aspects of it was - instead all I've had is a rather childish 'wait and see' teaser and an 'if you're not with us you're against us' attitude.  Neither are particularly helpful or come across as very professional.

PS  as for clubs, yes my experience is limited, having only ever designed and manufactured 2 putters to date - one standard and one truly revolutionary.   

Faceless names? I'm not the one who hasn't got a public profile. Just for the record and to reiterate what Chris said earlier I do have knowledge of what you are trying to achieve, almost 40 years in engineering design and manufacture should mean that I at least know what I'm talking about - but obviously as this appears to you as some kind of sleight as you obviously can't be bothered to read or understand my posts what more can I do? I've had a hand in machine tools, small die cast models, large scale plastics production, medical equipment, F1 and jet engines and have worked with some of the most exotic materials out - but obviously as I'm unpatriotic this counts for nought in your eyes.  Ho hum.

Eur Ing Tim Hawkins CEng BSc FIED MIME

MD, 3D Cubed Ltd Design and Technology

Paul, the reason nobody has any facts is that you're not providing any!  A teaser post, as others have posted above, is usually classed as SPAM and treated as such.  Your post sparked some interest, but you've not been able (or willing) to provide any and have simply kept on with your mantra of "no facts before the launch date"

I would suggest you seriously read some of the posts above rather than simply dismiss them because they aren't totally backing you.  Plenty of intelligent questions have been asked but, again, no answers have been provided.  As Tim says above, this is a questionable marketing strategy and the initial interest you created is vanishing rapidly.

The links you give in your first post reroute to "Golf Alchemy Ltd".  A quick Google search links their address to the middle of an industrial estate and a factory called "Simon & Dean Ltd", no sign of anything related to golf.  You do point out though that this isn't live yet, so I assume the amateurish site it points at is simply a mistake.

The other link you give http://www.lookscreative.co.uk/ points to the same page as http://www.paulfrance.co.uk/ - more poor quality web sites. 

If your venture is genuine, good luck.  Unfortunately if your and Andrew's (I'm assuming you're the same person) posts here are an example of your marketing strategy i think you may need it and you might be better sticking to the photography.

By the way, the post above is about the thrid time you've said you're not going to post again.  Hopefully you may mean it this time.  

As a (Welsh) Dragon , thats the worst pitch i have ever heard , started with hot air ,oh and then continued with hot air. 

My curiousness has turned to frustration, and Mr France PR manager??really?

Embargoed implies that your product is arriving from another country? not manufactured in the uk? wrong choice of word or is it really being shipped in??

Your recent comments have been detrimental to this thread and you have certainly alienated a potential customer base ,30000+ worldwide members on here. So congratulations to your and your new employee Andrew. (thank heavens he now has a job)   

good luck, but ..........you guessed it ...IM OUT!

"and the inventor knows as much about metal and golf clubs as anyone on here"

Keep digging!

A wedge is a wedge is a wedge and is only as good as the player using it.

I think I may know the person who is behind Golf Alchemy Ltd.

Mario, if you read this get in touch as I can vouch for these people on here & if given the chance can give some serious credibility to your product if it's as good as you say.

I will try & get down to Hagley Golf Range to see view / demo the product myself. I'm assuming you have some left handed seeing as your a lefty yourself?

Thanks.

Has Mr France being deleting his own posts?  Bad form Sir.  Anyone got a cached version?

Not sure I can play tomorrow now that I've learnt my wedges. are redundant

I think that says it all Tim.

or as sound as the tin it's hiding in - possibly 

Website still shows coming soon but after a year since this original 'launch', who knows.