Maximum handicaps

Always a sticky subject with many different opinions and ways of thinking with how fair a handicap system is and how well it works.

Playing off what is 'mid-level' handicap, it obviously enables me to be competitive with guys playing off single figures. All fine and well.

My gripe with the system is the maximum handicap. In my opinion, 28 for competition play is too much. Socially, people can play off what they like, everyone has to start somewhere and whittle it down, not a problem there, but I have a real bugbear about people scoring par and coming off a hole with 4 points. No one should be entitled to 2 shots in a hole where there is something to play for.

In my view, the maximum (and I know some clubs & matchplays comps employ this already) should be 18. That way a fairly tidy round of say 88, would not storm a field a win scoring -10 or something.

Hi Dave, a man after my own heart. We all know that the current system is a complete disaster, although the very low handicappers like it, as it allows them to play very poorly a lot of the time, yet still retain these low handocaps, which I am sure they hold for prestigious purposes only.

Two 1 handicappers tied for first place in our club championship with a 36 hole score of 159 but they will still remain 1 handicap. In the old days of whole numbers they would both be playing off 3. Handicaps then were based on your best ability in summer conditions, not all this nett douible bogey c**p.

The only fair way is to count the number of pars and birdies that these so called high handicappers seem to be able to pull out of a hat when needed and then don't count any score over bogey. Even a short hitter like me is capable of scoring a bogey on any hole.

I too am fed up of being taken for a ride, especially in matchplay against these jokers.

There never, ever will be a totally fair handicap system.

Every system used has it's own flaws that can be utilised by people to 'Help' them!

One of my bugbears is playing off 3/4 of your handicap.  This helps the low handicap players as they don't lose as many shots as a high handicap player.

If we had a fair handicap system we would never need to play off 3/4's, we could play off our full handicaps and it would be a fair game.

One of the problems that I can see is the number of competitiors in golf club competitions would fall.

If you were a 23 handicap golfer you wouldn't bother entering a competition if you were made to play with a handicap of 18.

I have played in many competitions and it is obvious that some of the people playing there are not playing off their correct handicap.  The GTour being an obvious one.  I know of certain people who play there with a handicap that is much higher than the one they should be using.  Some people get around this by not putting any scorecards in on any sites, this means nobody can check their handicap!

There must be a better system than the present one, but I've yet to hear about it!  Maybe one day it will happen.

Russ

Very deep thinking young man !!

One of my bugbears is playing off 3/4 of your handicap.  This helps the low handicap players as they don't lose as many shots as a high handicap player.

3/4 is the only fair way, yes the lower handicaps do not lose as many shots as those off a higher handicap, but they also have a much more difficult task to improve their scores as much as the higher handicaps do.

Handicaps were always 24 and in matchplay no one received more than 18 shots, which is how it should be. Stablefords were always 7/8ths and not full as they seemk to do these days.

Personally I feel that the only fair fomat is medal play, after all the game is about how many strokes over 18 holes, not points.

I note your point about the Gtour, I too witnessed this on my first sortie into this competition and realised that I would not be competitive enough, so I never entered any more, which is a shame, because the format is good and it is a well run tournament.

If eveybodies handicap was a true reflection of their ability then there would be no need for the 3/4 handicap.  All game could be played off the full handicap.  The problem is that the handicap system isn't working as well as it should be, this is partly due to some people manipulating their handicaps!

I played a medal at my golf club with a player who was ten shots higher with his handicap.  He drove the ball further than me, and took one less club to what I would take.  Now I'm not a short hitter but he consistantly hit the ball further than me.

He did have a few bad shots, not as many as somebody with his handicap should have!

Reductions in his handicap have followed, but they are taking time to get down to where he should be.

On another point, I was talking with a guy at my club who told us all sitting at the table, that he had asked the handicap secretary to reduce his handicap as he thought he was playing to a lower handicap than he actually had.  The handicap secretary refused and told him to put some more scorecards in!  Now I would have thought that if somebody wanted to be cut, then they should be cut.

Russ

I have just started play golf again after a break of about 8 years, used to play nearly everyday when i worked nights, got my handicap down to around 7/8.

I started up a month ago and my 1st 3 rounds I was calculated on here as a 18. People will always play better the more they play so if you are working hard at your game you will win touneys but your handicap will be cut. Fair enough as i think thats what i was playing at. If people are willing to cheat to win tourneys then its down to them, your only cheating yourself, im happy to play and work on getting my handicap down by playing more and enjoying it, Will i ever make money from golf nope!

Play to enjoy and if you do win along the way bonus but do it by the rules and be happy!!!!!!

Secondly...... My friend who I played with last week shot 115 he has only been playing a few months would he be able to get an offical handicap at 28 (now if we were to do the 18handicap as the highest, I would say he would never be close to that and might aswell not bother playing.)

Please reply with your thoughts........

My view is if people want to artificially keep their h/caps high then you cant stom them, However a couple of rules I would introduce would go like this.

1. All cards returned in a society must be put on the system ( eg golfshake ).

2. Anyone without 3 cards on the system must play off the lowest h/cap they have ever played off until 3 cards are on the system.

3. Blobs would be counted as 1 pt for h/cap purposes but 0 pt for scoring.

4. No more than 4pts to be scored on a hole. ( played with a 28 h/caper got on par 5 si5 green in 2. could have been 7 pts foe albertross).

5. No gimees.

6. Pick up ball when cant score.

Dave CAC handed Geordie.

A constant theme this, albeit mainly from decent players. Whatever any of the esteemed Golfshakers want to say, or however indignate they want to get - if people want to cheat the system, they will find a way of doing i regardless of the PGA/CONGU/whatever ruling body they want to blame. I am a relative newby to golf, been playing about three years entirely for pleasure. I do not intend or expect to become the next Tiger or Phil or Rory. Its a hobby.We have all seen some ridiculous scores entered for the handicaps claimed, but you know what - My father, God rest his soul, always taught me that '"for bad to survive, all good has to do is  - nothing". I see stories on here all of the time where people say " he shouldnt have had that score". Well you know what - put up or shut up. If you think somebody is a bandit or cheating, either say something (at the time, and with evidence) or shut up. I always do, and do not feel any way about who doesnt like it. I but remember when golf was regarded a a gentlemans game - if thats the case, then speak the truth and be damned. I refuse to allow the obvious cheats and bandits to carry on unchallenged. If people don't like it - so be it, I know who my friends are after 50-odd years on this planet, and i bow to no man. 1001 clubs will take my money and decent people still outnumber the bad.

Or am I getting senile...........

Rant over........

Whilst potentially I stand to benefit from the handicap system giving me an artificial advantage over far better players than I will probably ever be, I don't feel good about the possibility of winning a society golf day prize purely due to the fact I've been given loads more strokes than my fellow players. For me ones gross score is the true measure of your ability and level of achievement. 

As the maximum 28 isn't enough for this to happen just yet, I'm so far spared this embarassment. Some societies I believe do allow up to 36 handicap, in which case I would potentially be getting closer to the prize money as my PB so far of 108 less 36 = 72 net. This might just win it, compared to the 80 I actually get (a pyrrhic victory if ever there was one!)

However even at my relatively low level of ability there are obvious flaws in the system, as a guy who plays nearly every weekday in my society still has a handicap of 27, so he's giving me just 1 shot, yet he consistently comes in at least 10 shots or more better than me.

So my take on it is that handicap application should only be for friendly club and society play where it's a social mixed ability playing group. Any form of serious competitive play should be without any handicapping applied. So if you're good enough, you will win without any manipulation of your scores whatsoever.  

John

I have worked out that you and I are roughly the same age. Your post rants about low handicappers whoo should be off a higher handicap and high handicappers who should be off a lower handicap. You seem to have a solution to everything. Lighten up and and grow old gracefully.