club membership

I am thinking of joining a golf club to try and play more golf and also to help me improve my handicap.

With the current money climate you would think clubs would be desparate to gain new members but it does not seem to be the case.

I would love to join a club and be able to play regular golf but clubs still want joining fees and high yearly membership fees that the average person just cannot justify paying.

The best price i can find is my local muni course at over £400 but then your missing out on the social side of the club away from the course.

Dont you think clubs should drop the joining fee and give some sort of incentive for new members more so the ones that cannot play more than 3 or 4 times a week?

I personally think any club asking for a joining fee at the moment is taking the mick.  With the rise in pay and plays and the economy the way it is, you would think they would just be happy to get the membership fees in.   

You'll have to shop around as some clubs are offerring deals or have removed joining fees for a short period.  The problem you will have is you will want to join a good club (obviously) and as they will know they are a good club they can afford to leave the joining fees in place.  It's worth asking if they will split the cost over a few years.  Most will go for this as it guarantees you as a member for more than one year as well as them getting their joining fees (obviously if you leave you will have to pay any outstanding joining fee you owed)

The last thing you want to do is to join a club because it is cheap and not enjoy playing the course or quickly get bored of it, so choose carefully. 

 I couldn't agree more. There are certain clubs that can command the joining fee (I'd bet my bottom dollar that these clubs would be 'too exclusive' for my liking anyway...always check out the course first, it's got to have the right balance of challenge and variety so that you don;'y get bored with it) but the majority of clubs are struggling financially, and this majority will get bigger: you've only got to look at the offers clubs are giving: eg Willow Valley (where the NE qualifier was held a couple of weeks ago) is offering membership £50 p mth...great value. I played there on a Sat aft a few mths back for £14, it used to be £40 a couple of yrs back. So it does depend on where you live and how far you're prepared to travel and it's always worth negotaiting...what's the worst that can happen? If they say no you wont be seeing them again anyway.

 I'd personally stay away from a Muni, not for snobby reasons but the overall condition of the course, the tee time availability and inevitable waiting, especially when golf is on the telly which brings out the masses of hackers.

Where do you live Jason and which is your nearest course?

TheLyth

Deals always depend on demand.

Here in Leeds we have 4 Muni's, 3 Pay & Plays and numerous Private Clubs so there is competition for Members, so a number of Clubs offer No Joining Fee. But you will pay from £750 per year at most Clubs.

For you in Derby, it seems that there is not a lot of competition for Members so you may have to pay a Joining Fee. Pastures GC offer £100 JF and £324 fees paid over 10 months. Its only a 9holer but that is possibly your best Deal. Just ask around.

TheLyth

Hi Oli, Northant sure does look like a nice club to play whenever I have been past it!

I am a member of the bargain hunters Im afraid and ended up joining Sherfield Oaks. This is part of the Crown Network of golf and has over 30 courses. For my membership I can play at any of these 30 clubs free of charge during the week (and after 1pm at weekends!) and have the choice of two courses where I joined.

Full membership there is around £1200 a year. With regards to the joining fee, there is usually room for movement (and in fact mine was dropped completely!)

Jason,

If you're not restricted on what time you play, see what is on offer for twilight golf at some of these private clubs.  I'm working in Newbury at the moment and playing Donnington Grove and Donnington Valley (only 5 minutes apart but two very different courses) after work for just £15 and £14 respectively, an absolute bargain.  For the number of times I play there (and the fact that I will only be able to do this for another couple of weeks) it was cheaper for me to pay as I went rather than join.  Some clubs even offer lower rate membership with restriced tee times (5 day membership, ect)

I joined the Belfry on a restricted tee time membership.  I get to play the PGA and the Derby 7 days a week for £650 per year, with the only restriction being I have to tee off after 3:00pm in the summer and 11:00am in the winter.  I can play outside those times for a reduced green fee.  Given that I wanted to play most of my golf mid-week after work or Friday afternoons, this suited me down to the ground. 

Jason

I am not sure if it is true but heard that Mickleover are not charging a joining fee at the moment.

The other good deals that are about are with direct-teetimes.co.uk, four of us played St Thomas's Priory in Rugely the other week for £6.00 each.

I've considered joining a club many times, but I like to travel round and would get bored being tied to a club. I play 2/3 times per week (midweek mornings) and must've have played on a dozen different courses this year. Trying Woodham Golf and Country Club - which is another new one for me tomorrow.

Most clubs in my area (Tyneside/Durham) have dropped their joining fees and charge between £400 and £600 for an annual membership which can be paid monthly. Like I say I've been tempted but would find it too restrictive.

Jason, come over to Notts.  My club Oakmere almost permanently waves the joining fee and the annual rates are reasonable if you are going to be playing twice a week.

There is a little clutch of decent courses just North of Nottingham (Mapperley, Springwater, Ramsdale, Rufford and Oakmere) so the memberships are reasonably competitive and I think most of them you can spread the cost by Direct Debit.

for that sort of money i wouldnt expect much tbh

it does bob but unfortunately it also needs:

cutting

reseeding

maintenance

and for 275 a year you cant expect too much can you?

Which course is that Bob?

I personally think any club asking for a joining fee at the moment is taking the mick.

Chris, I don't personally agree with this as if it is a well established club & it is run well & they are meeting their yearly quota of members then why should they? If they were to all drop their joining on fees then you would get anybody & everybody wanting to join. Although the interview process might put some people off.

I think if you were to have joined a club which was purley a 'members' club you would appreciate the social side of it.

Have football clubs reduced their season ticket prices this year or the price of a burger etc??

If you feel that a joining on fee is out of order then the club probably isn't right for you in the first place.

John.

"Have football clubs reduced their season ticket prices this year"

Yes John, the vast majority have.  Only two premiership clubs held their prices, the rest reduced them. 

The country is in recession and people are looking to cut back on luxuries.  If I were faced with a choice between two courses that I enjoyed playing equally with similar membership fees but one had a joining fee, it very likely would sway me.  Given the rise of pay and play courses, membership, on the whole, is falling and clubs are desperatly trying to keep membership up; even your club waived the membership fee for the next 40 new members this year.  I know what you are saying about 'anyone and everyone wanting to join', but surely this is a good position for the club to be in as they can pick and choose their members.  The ability to pay a joining fee does not make you right for the club, just as the inability to pay it does not make you wrong for it. 

I just feel that joining fees are putting off and even preventing prosepctive members and given the current financial climate it could harm the clubs in the long run.  I appreciate that if you have made up your mind that you definitely want to join a certain club then you will grin and bear it, but it could scare people off before they have even had a look at it. 

Golf Clubs need a flow of money, or a Bank Account with a lot of money in it.

If the membership are not willing to spend money in the Clubhouse, they need to get Income from somewhere else. Either taking more Visitors or charging an Entrance Fee. I remember a story from years ago when most Clubs had a Waiting List of a couple of years and the yearly Fees were about £350. One Club used to get many visitors and on most days the course saw more of them than Members. Anyway a few of these members were upset that they didn't have the course to themselves (that is what they thought it should be like with only 350 members) so they asked the Committe to ban all visitors. The answer they got was "if all visitors were banned then the yearly Fees would be over £1000". Needles to say Visitors were still allowed.

TheLyth

I agree if there were 2 clubs with similar facilites etc then you would probably go for the one without a fee. My club offers the facility to pay the joining fee over 4 years so it's not a huge intial outlay.

"Given the rise of pay and play courses, membership, on the whole, is falling and clubs are desperatly trying to keep membership up"

Most clubs within a 10mile radius of mine all have waiting lists?

Is that fact or assumption? My club waived the joining for for 40 members only & that was to generate funds to pay for more green staff, not to clear debts etc.

Turning up at a pay & play course these days is a lottery, you never know what to expect & what conditions your going to receive. This is what puts me off & if I have to pay a joining fee to give me peace of mind then I don't mind doing that.

I agree joining fees are off putting but it depends on if your getting value for money.

I got the declining membership thing from a report in TG where the rise in pay and play was attrinuted by the clubs to the fall in membership. 

There are varying levels of pay and play John, and many members courses allow pay and play now.  The courses I play down in Newbury, Donnington Grove and Donnigton Valley are opposite ends of the spectrum.  Donny Grove is aimed at societies and has regular amateur comps so is usually in great condition but can be expensive to play due to the need for upkeep.  Donny Valley is only 5 minutes up the road but loses much trade due to having Grove so close.  It is predominantly a members course but is very welcoming and friendly.  Because the course is quiet (due to it's neighbour) it is very well kept.  There is also the local muni in the middle of the racecourse, but I've been told it's very 'flag in a field' and rough and ready. 

You can find some good pay and plays, but I appreciate that it is more of a lottery than you would have at your course. 

Jason,

My comments were refering to Chris's comments about people being in a recession & cutting back on luxuries. To me spending £00's on a season ticket & then on average £5-£6 on refreshments at the game class as luxuries.

This is where I was making my comparisons.

If you add up the cost of a season ticket (obviousley the team you support will make a difference) , refreshments, programmes, shirts etc over the course of a year it's probably not far off a joining fee & green fees??

I agree money doesn't buy etiqutte or manners but a joining fee will deter the football shirt, jean wearing 4 ball who turn up at the muni & hack it to pieces from joining a club. 

Golf has changed over the years and although the number of Players has increased, "Official Numbers" have dropped. This is because more and more Golfers are not Members of a Club.

You used to need a Hcp to join a Private Club, so the Muni Clubs had a licence to print money. Some bright spark saw this and the Pay & Play arrived. Today there are a large number of 'Nomad' Golfers who enjoy a Social round and are not bothered about competitive golf.

So today, each of us can play our Golf in an enviroment that we wish to.

TheLyth

Martin,

I think that the make up of Societies may have changed. Most used to be a group of Golfers who got together (usually work places), but they were already Members of a Club. They were then able to allow the odd Non-Golfer in too. Today they are mostly made up of people who are not members of a Club, some people joining to get a Hcp.

TheLyth

I also think that the advent of the Internet and sites like this have opened up Golf to many people who wouldn't have 'joined in' years ago. Years ago a guy playing at a Leeds Muni would never have 'hooked up' with guys playing in Wakefield and Sheffield, like they do today.

TheLyth

Just thought I'd throw in my observations of club memberships in the brief time that I've been playing.

I recently joined a Crown Golf club close to my home (Oak Park in Crondall) and it has everything that I was looking for in a club.  Not too expensive, close to home, great but challenging courses (A 9 and an 18 hole), good practice facilities, a course that would help me improve (grrr!, that 18 hole is a toughie!) a thriving social side and a good mix of people that seem very friendly.  The major plus point for me is that I am able to pay for my golf monthly and still have all the member benefits.

I too gave up a football season ticket to concentrate on playing more golf to try and improve (plus I've become disillusioned with football recently).  Although, I dont get out to play more than 1 or 2 times a week if I'm lucky, I feel as if I am getting good value for money.  Football was costing me about £1000 a year all in including train travel, beer, beer and more beer etc. The golf costs are about the same - just drinking less beer in the club house (well, at the moment)

Before I thought about joining a club, I thought that in the current financial climate, clubs would be lowering or removing their joining fee's (I think Crown Golf have dropped there joining fees...but they aren't huge like private members clubs can be!). One private club local to me was prepared to reduce the joining fee from £800 to £400 but not drop it altogether if 2 of us joined.  In the end I decided not to go with that club for different reasons and not just because they wanted a joining fee.

I really do think its horses for courses with golf memberships, if you want beautifully kept courses and exlcusivity, it all comes at a price and its only fair to pay for it.  It'a all about choice and what you can afford at the end of the day.

The whole subject drifted onto why you would and wouldn't join a club, so I think it's a valid question Jason (although tenuous!).  I know that I wouldn't want to join one of the clubs Dave Ley is a member of when 40% of the competitors in the big annual comp came in with 40+ points and 8 players came in with over 50! 

And yes, most topics drift off on this forum as the discussion progresses

Martin,

You make a valid point here, and one should have a look at the Fixture List and Comp results before making the decision to join a Club.

At Horsforth, we have a Club Comp almost every week-end and a Mid-week one on numerous occasions. The Club also have a Rabbits Section that has its own agenda. We also have a Seniors Section too but I'm a couple of years from that.

For me, as a low Hcp'er I will play in Division One of all Medals and Stablefords and most of our Open Comps are Match-Play with qualifying to get in, with a max 18 Hcp put on them. Then I can play in the Scratch Team or The Nett Team. The argument that High Hcps win everything can be countered by the fact that they have no chance with the Scratch Events, which carry more prestige and money than the other Events at most Clubs. Also through the Club I get the chance to play many other Courses, simply because I am a Member, courses like Sandmoor, Scarcroft, Pannal, Fulford, The Glen, Gosforth, West Byfleet, Chilwell Manor and Crans-sur-Sierre to name just a few.

We have a large Practice Ground, a Chipping Green, Putting Green and Driving Net. The only down side is that the course gets very wet in winter and we have to use Fairway Mats but you can't have everything. Or if you can it comes at a price.

TheLyth