Golf forum

Been thinking about this, theres a nice shiney set of blades in the shop that i look at everytime im in. But how much difference do they make as apposed to cavaty backs?

I dunno if i have got my physics wrong here, but surly the front of the clubs where you hit the ball are the same for both types, so both hit right will send the ball straight any open or closed club face should impart spin on the ball for either type to. Also as the loft is the same the ball should go the same height to?

looking at your handicap Matt, i'd stay away if i was you. I tried some on the simulator at urban golf saturday night and produced some fantastic air shots

Everyone these days is looking for the easy way out, in other words they are trying to buy their improvement from over the counter.

In days gone by, all clubs sold were blades, so everyone of my era, either, learned how to strike a golf ball correctly, or gave up the game.

The beautiful thing about blades is that there is nothing more satisfying than striking one perfectly. The newer generation of irons let one get away with so much and give no feedback whatsoever as to how good the strike was.

You are hankering, Matt, so why not borrow a set and give them a try. You will soon find out whether or not you will be able to hit them.

A 26 handicapper buying blades isn't a good idea in my opinion - John quite rightly said to borrow some and see how he gets on.

Matt you asked why they are harder to hit, blades are a LOT harder to hit than cavitybacks there is no doubt about it. You have a sweetspot on blades about the size of a 5p coin, if you miss this sweet spot it will feel terrible, vibrations will run up your arms and the ball will go nowhere.

On cavity backed clubs the sweet spot is much larger, and on off centre hits the forgiveness is much better.

If you strike your irons well, blades will feel great, there really is no better feeling - but if your 26.7 your obviously not hitting the ball that well (yet!) so personaly I would get down to 15 or lower then make the switch, otherwise you run the risk of getting a lot worse a lot quicker.

A lot of pros use cavity backed clubs now - only opting for blades at 8,9,pw

That said, the chances are you won't be able to hit them as well as your cavity backs - but certainly that isn't a given my any means - I say give them a bash at a demo day or in a shop for 30 mins at least - it could be that your hit them beautifully and if that's the case you'll fall in love with them!

Everyone these days is looking for the easy way out, in other words they are trying to buy their improvement from over the counter.

In days gone by, all clubs sold were blades, so everyone of my era, either, learned how to strike a golf ball correctly, or gave up the game.

Haha - John, in days gone by all shafts were made from hickory, I am guessing you saw no wrong in switching to steel and then graphite - or from persimmon to titanium so whats wrong with blades to cavity backs? Are you not guilty of buying an easier game too?

Have you ever hit a ball with hickory shafted clubs, J P? I have and I can tell you that the hickory shaft was in fact a very good one and very powerful. Steel shafts came in about the early 1930's and the reason was probably because of a shortage of hickory, like we now have these ghastly jumbo sized woods made of space age material just because of a world wide shortage of Persimmon.

I still have my persimmon woods, safely tucked away till the time I start striking a driver correctly, if that day ever comes again.

I also still own what, IMO, are the best looking blades ever manufactured and I am not far away from being able to use them again.

Personally speaking I find no difference between steel or graphite shafts, we have to suffer all these different types just to keep the industry making money. I still play with a balata covered ball and have done all my life. It is very nice that they are now considered obsolete and the prices are rock bottom.

J P - you have just explained why the blade club is superior to the cavity-back club.

With a blade or blade-like club you definitely know when you have not hit the ball correctly since you get the feedback through the shaft as it vibrates like hell and the ball doesn't travel as far or as straight, i.e. positive feedback. So you can then learn how to hit the ball correctly.

Cavity-backs on the other hand do not provide the vibrational feedback, and because they are so forgiving you can still have a reasonable outcome with a poor shot. Thus you do not learn how to hit the ball correctly. Yes, they are easier to play with, but they don't make a better player of you.

I'm still baffled by the use of the term "game-improvemnt" for clubs which make it very difficult to appreciate whats happening when you hit the ball, and make the necessary adjustments to improve one's game!!

Matt, as what everyone says here! give them a try first, you never know you might be hitting the ball sweet and with blades you will feel it within the first 10 swings. I tried blades a while back (before i had a handicap) and i thought that they were terible but this was only down to my ball strking and i should never have been using them in the 1st place.  

However I have just changed from my old cavity backs to a set of second hand forged Taylormade 300's (these are between cavity backs and blades but not quite muscle backs) . And already im seeing improvements in my game, especially on the distance and control. But as with Blades if you strike these off centre you feel it. 

What i would advise if you are going to purchase some new toys, would be to book lessions with them before you even think of going to the course, as a pro sould make the trasnition a bit less painfull. 

You do get better feedback from a balde - no doubt. But do you really think by giving a high handicaper a blade that the 'feedback' is going to make him or her better?

The only feedback you'll get is a horrible feeling in your arms and hands, all that's telling you is that you haven't hit one out the middle, it's not telling you why.

Consistently hitting bad shots doesn't make one better no matter how much 'vibrational feedback' - if that was the case I'd be Tiger Woods.

Matt,

Before you buy have a word with Chris Curry. He uses blades and I am sure he would let you strike his 5 iron...

NWOT.......

Im out with chris on friday so i ll have a go.

No what i was getting at is like i dont understand how theres that much difference as the hitting surface is the same.

I ll give it a try

Matt - its all down to the overall design of the club head - cavity backs have what is known as a "perimeter-weighted" design which means that the mass of the club-head is distributed about the preimeter of the club-head which increases the size of the "middle" of the club.

So even though the size of the club head is the same, the "middle" or sweet-spot is larger in a cavity-back than a blade, which results in a more forgiving club, but sacrifices are made in achieving this, e.g. you can't manufacture shots like you can with a blade, and the ball flight isn't as penetrating as with a blade.

I hope this makes things a bit clearer. 

Another good point is that the clubhead on blades is much smaller than cavity backs

Matt,

Blade golf clubs by design have a much smaller "sweet spot" and as such will are much less forgiving. As mentioned above a shot that is slighly off the sweet spot will result in 1. a uncontrolled shot 2. heavy vibration through the shaft. However a cleaner shot in from the "sweetspot" will result in more feel and more control (being able to shape shots and induce backspin is eaisier from blades). However blades aid these types of shot but do not produce them, that is up to the skill of the player.

Cavity backs were designed to be much more forgivingand are therefor more suited for the Mid to high handicaper.

Having said all that, with the advances in Iron technology of ther past few years, the cavity back irons now available are getting closer to the performance of Blades*

The Bottom line is that its your ability with your irons that makes the diffrence overall.

Cheers.

 *edit: That is if you beleive all the marketing hype of Iron manufacturers

Hmm, may have to do a bit of research into this....

The first set of clubs I had, were titleist blades, and ping persimmon woods.

I still say my best 3 shots ever were with those clubs. The 6 iron, the 3 iron and the 3 wood, magic.

I wonder If another set would help me get some consistency back with my distances?

Maybe a part set like these.

These are the Titleist 990 I use, also have a set of the 990B. These are muscle back clubs

 http://www.golfreview.com/cat/irons/titleist/PRD_61044_2940crx.
aspx

Tim - the most obvious muscle-back iron that I've seen is one MacGregor brought out several years back - the MacGregor V-Foil M675, this e-bay page has a god photo of what I mean, the muscle is very exaggerated.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/MacGregor-V-Foil-M675-Iron-Set-4-PW-Golf-Club-
Stiff_W0QQitemZ170201830228QQihZ007QQcategoryZ115280QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD2VQQcmd
ZViewItem?_trksid=p1638.m122

Im going to try some blades on friday.

But what would the normal route be caverty backs then muscle backs then blades?

What are game improvement irons?

Matt,

As John P said above, at one time there was no such thing as cavity irons or muscle backs, all you got were blades. So from that premis i would suggest that most people today start with Cavity backs because of the forgiving nature of them, and then go onto blades.... muscle backs are quite a rare thing now as manufacturers are progressing the technologhy for cavity backs and (if you beleive the hype) the performace levels are getting closer to blades. In all reality a handicap player of above 15 really should be sticking with cavity backs for the enjoyment of the game.

I know the argument that a bad shot is a bad shot regardless of the result, however i belive that golf, like a lot of other sports, is confenence based so therefor 20 good results from poor shots over the course or 95+ shots when using cavity backs is far more benificial than 2 good results over the same amount of shots when using blades. But thats just me!

And let us know how you get on!

I agree with you Danny - but all of the latest attempts at optimizing blades are more like muscle-backs. The pure blade club is becoming a rarity because it is difficult to hit, and this results in reduced sales......

Matt - I hope that you enjoy having a go with blades - they are the best thing if you are a good ball striker. The best starting point for a highish handicapper like yourself is with a cavity back and once your handicap starts to come down then decide what is best for you, the variety is mind-boggling - my current set is what is known as a composite or progrssive set which has shallow cavity backs for the long irons for forgiveness and then on each club the cavity gets progressively shallower until the 8, 9 & PW are blades, and they really do suit me.

I pretty new to the game and I started with John Letters TXD Trilogy cavity backs.

Playing a couple of rounds with the club pro he suggested trying a club with less of a cavity as I was hitting the ball inconsistent distances so I tried out his Titleist 695MBs and was hitting the 7,8,9 very well but struggled a little with the others.

He suggested a progressive set such as the Titleist 735's but as money was a little tight I went for a set of John Letters F7's and am now hitting the ball with much more precision and consistency.

I also tried the Nike Pro Combo's which would have been my choice if I didn't get such a good deal with John Letters

With my little experience at golf I would say unless you are hitting the ball sweet everytime a full set of blades aren't for you!!!

If youre still wondering about the difference between hitting a ball with a blade over a cavity back, imagine slapping someone on the nose, its easy to hit but all the energy is spread across the hand. The other persons nose gets red, but thats about it.

Now punch them in the nose, all the energy is focussed into a small point, if youre a good enough aim , the other person will probably have a broken nose, becuase of the all energy ifocussed nto a small point.

Now run away...quickly

eh?

I get you

If you wish to try some blades, Matt, then I have my old set of Maruman Conductor Pro pure blades that cost $3000 (Yes 3 thousand dollars). They are in nice shiny condition. The set  comes with a gap wedge and I added a lob wedge of the same make but chromed as opposed to the satin finish of the rest.

They are too difficult to hit by me these days, but a good striker would immediately understand what he has in his hands. £100 plus postage and they are yours.

I've played with bladed clubs my entire golfing life, and just can't get on with cavity backed cast clubs at all. From an initial handicap of 36 as a junior, I dropped my handicap to 5 using them (Mizuno TP-19s) and still use them today. Anyone who tells you that blades are not for beginners isn't lying, but isn't being truthful either. Blades are for pure strikers of the ball, as the sweetspot is the size of a 1p peice right in the centre of the clubface. If you don't play often, then don't expect to get on well with blades unless you have a well grooved swing, but it is all down to personal preference.

When I first started playing all clubs were blades and were for many years.

I can agree entirely with your post Jonathan, will be interested to hear you history having achieved a fairly low handicap.

I didn't reach my full potential I'm afraid John. Turning pro was my goal, but University, beer, women, and then work knackered my golf up I'm afraid, thought the clubbed foot I was born with and nagging back problem related to it also held me back. I gave up golf completely at the age of 22, and am starting to get back into it this year.

Sorry to hear about all your problems, we all have had them at different times. I too was offered the Pros job at Malden Golf club in 1960 but there was no money in the game then, so stayed an amateur.

At least you have the chance to get your game back, I'm afraid that no matter how hard I try I just cannot seem to get the consistency I was once famed for.

I remember reading a similar opionon poll on Blades. Someone wrote very nice.

"One should not evaulaute the blades with the number of bad shots but the feeling that few good shots give are far more enjoyable and satisfying as compared to playing with CB, which hardly let you know whether u hit shot good or bad."

I switched to blade 2 weeks back and I was very happy to do so. I could shape the shot and feel good about some of the well connected shots. You will enjouy ur game more.

Every Golfer should play at least 3 rounds with blades to experience.