Forum > General golf topics

Matt Hargraves

Just theres a masive difference between me and the pro's lol

I get mine 140yrds

John Pettitt

Matt Hargraves

Darren Ramowski

Darren Ramowski

Christopher Watmore

I think in the summertime I hit 7 Iron about 160-165 yards carry.

This time of year I'm more around the 145-155 yards carry region depinding on temperature and wind.

Robbie Allison

7 iron - I would bring out the bag at 130 yards.

I tend to club down and ease it in tho..

NWOT........

Danny Brant

Paul Cook

this is the differance between us and the pro they know how far they hit it we just assume the distance

i was hitting it 150yards till i had some lessons now 160 to 165 yards

Gary Allen

This time of year i hit my 7 iron 140 to 150 yards.

Ian Poole

Pete Cave

Danny James

Philip Fayle

Matt Hargraves

Anthony Davies

My 7 goes about 160 but I'm trying to shorten my swing so have started taking 1 club more. Amazing how difficult this is to do sometimes due to the built in "man-ego-distance-syndrome" I seem to have developed over the years.

Colin Astbury

Are we talking forwards or sideways. Either way about 140 yrds for me straight forward to the right  or to the left. No one knows where its going to stop

Danny King

140 to 150 here, depending on time of year, conditions and how much i drank the night before ;o)

Unfortunalty the guy i play with is about 15 to 20 yards longer than me on each iron, and which causes me all sorts of problems when i ask the fated "what you taking on this?" as it always throws me off.

Joe Howell

John Pettitt

Hi Danny, interesting comment about your friend. I too had a friend, off 3 handicap, who was totally obessed with hitting less club than me to a hole. Why, I never did understand.

On our short 8th over a valley I used to slightly close an eight iron and punch it in and then would let him see what I had taken, knowing full well that he would take a 9 iron, and then come up short.

Sarah Mathews

Keith Bateman

I average 150 yards with a 7 iron when it's not raining (or very moist air).  Less off a tee on par 3's as I don't get the added ball compression against the turf. So I try to avoid tee shots using tees on par 3's.

Funny thing is, I hit the ball further on the course than on the range.   I'm guessing it is all about the balls the range uses.

Keith Bateman

Tony,

I seem to do OK for consistent ball striking with my long game these days. Then it all goes horribly wrong from 60 yards in. I have a dreadful short game. I can nail a short pitch on the range when I have a perfect lay and I'm totally level. As you know, around the greens on a real course it is very unusual get that type of luck! So usually the ball either goes pin-high but nowhere near the pin, or I duff it and it only goes three feet. Then there are the putts. Too many 3 putts when they should have been easy 2's. i.e. lipping-out is a constant bug-bear of mine.

Practice, practice, practice I guess.

Matt Hargraves

Chris Perry

Danny King

John P,

I dont know why i do it, but it seems inbuilt that as soon as i step up to a shot (especially a par 3) i always ask what he's taken/taking. I know that it shouldnt matter and i should play my game. 

I like your style about punching the shot just to watch you partener fall short. Ill have to make sure my friend isnt doing the same!

John Pettitt

I learned very quickly that it is most important in golf to always be up, if this requires one or two clubs more than your playing partners, then so be it.

It is a game of how many and strategy plays a very big part in ones score at the end of the round.

Keith Bateman

Danny,

I'm surprised nobody else has jumped on you about this yet: To ask another player what club they used on the hole before you play it is against the rules of golf. From this year you can now ask them after the hole is played, but not before the hole is finished.

It comes under giving and receiving advice on how to play the shot .... a real no-no unless you are playing partners (instead of playing opponents).

Terry Gardner

A 7 iron for me usually means around 130/135 yards carry.  Lately though, I can easily get 10 yards more without 'going after it'.  The real problem is I don't hit the ball very hard, so I only get it to stop or pull up in winter.  During the summer that means I play all courses as if they're links courses, and try to judge the run out accordingly.

Just came back from Portugal, where I didn't bother calcualting the distances from metres to yards, as the ball was going 10% futher because the weather was warmer!  i.e. I just took whatever club I would for the yardage, without adding 10% for the change from metres, so a 7 iron was 130/135 metres - about 150 yards.  (I know what I mean !)

Christopher Simms

A 7 iron for me is 140-150, depending on conditions.Although, a few weeks ago, i went out with a golf society to our local course,with the wind blowing as hard as iv'e ever seen.We came to a 150yd par 3, when one of the lads i was with, took out his driver and put it on the green. He went on to win nearest the pin.So it shows, it does depend on the  conditions.

Paul Mason

150 -160 yards carry , except in portugal where it goes metric and its a 150-160 metre carry ! I Kid you not !

and dont ask about the driving !

Alan Steel

Gary Cope

Danny King

Keith,

I hear what your saying, and i would never do it in a Comp or a medal, but when im playing a friendly round which is where i improve my game its just somthing that we Both (my usual Playing partner and i) do just for confirmation that we are thinking the same thing (Yardage etc). Espacaly if its a course that we havent played before, or the tee positions have been radically changed.

Anthony Davies

I thought they'd changed the rulr this year that you can ask your playing partner what club they used/are using? have I got this wrong??

Chris Perry

Anthony,

Yes you can ask now, but only after both of you have played your shot. 

Terry Manning

From the 150 yard marker to a level green 7 iron, from a higher green 6 iron and a lower green an 8 iron. Of course wind and temprature will affect things.

Simon Elliott

probably 150 winter and 160 in summer.

 conditions will make massive difference though from lie, temp, wind, grass direction etc etc!!!

  Sarah, off 36 hitting it that far on the range?!!! wow, would like to see you take on single figure handicappers! you would probably out hit most of them! I hate to doubt you but this is further than the women pros would hit it at the range.

 PS range balls go around 10-20% less distance and also the lack of give on the surface means a less than solid contact as the club bounces alot.

Hugh Byrne

well I play of 11 and a well hit 7 iron is 130-135 yds carry for me.  I play with a lot of players in bwteen 7-14 handicap range and I am probaly avergae or just above distance wise!

Surprising so many high handicappers in this post believe they hit the ball 150yds+. Is this consistsently with a good ball flight or perhaps this is a little revealing as to why they are high handicappers.

I guess when all is said and done it's accuracy that's counts and not what club you take or how far you hit it.  I would suggest you take more club hit at 80-90% and obtain more accuracy.  It's worth a try to see if you handicap improves....  it shaved 3-4 points of my handicap last year.

Christopher Watmore

Everyone will vary a little Hugh and no doubt equipment will play some part in the Yardages people see. An interesting thing I've done the last three times I played, Monday at Greetham with some friends, Wednesday in a Competition at My Home Club and Yesterday in a Social Game at My Club is take a SkyCaddie out on the course to see how far, I'm hitting the ball, how far my playing partners hit the ball and also how much my partners underestimate yardages.

I found yesterday I was hitting my 7 Iron consistantly around the 175 yard mark give or take a yard or two. Thats including the roll and would seem consistant with the fact I was hitting a steady draw with it. I would expect my 7 Iron to normally be within the 160-165 range if I hit it straight.

Couple of the guys I played with told me they hit there 7 Irons 150-160yards but the SkyCaddie revealed them to be mistaken and they were only in the 135-145 yard range. These are the same guys that would often under estimate yardages to green and wonder why their shots came up short. They obviously don't perceive depth too well.

Must admit the first time I used the SkyCaddie it surprised me a few times when I saw the yardage on the unit and never have thought it was that far to the green. Certainly making the game better for me having that on my waist. 

Hugh Byrne

Everyone does indeed vary a lot.

I too have recently strated using a GPS(http://www.golf-plus.co.uk Caddy Lite £129). Can recommend as  nice basic, cheap model with easy to read distances.

As  I said "carry" so for a yardage to front of green, with flag 15-20yds on I normally take my 7iron(130-135yd carry). As depending on the shape of shot I use I can get another 10-20yds after landing.  But as I say it deoends in the shape of shot I am playing.  Anyway If I want to bash hell out of it and deloft etc. I can add another 20yds(but am not that acurate :-(

I must say the weather 'temperature' can reduce the distance but I an easy 10yds when cold.  So on those very cold days players should be prepared to take another club.

It's amazing how many people ask you a distance when you hae a GPS.  I think they are good at speeding up the speed of play (good news) and as you say help people to know their true club differences.  It's also suprising how far people DO NOT hit their drives as well. The tour players length, I must say is amazing!

Terry Wall

I can't believe what I am reading - you guys -and at least one girl - must be the longest iron players in the country. However, given your handicaps these shots must also be the least accurate in the world!

 Nothing gives me more pleasure than someone who says "I took a 7, what did you take" when I can reply "a 5, but look who's closer". Up to, typically, 180 yards, why should you care what you or anyone takes - just find out how to hit your irons the same distance every time and take the money - or the trophy.

Hugh Byrne

Anyway here are some average yardages based on analysis for a reasonably proficient 40yr old male golfer hit with a full swing and no wind.

 and here are some yardages for average PGA Tour player

4-Iron 210-220
5-Iron 195-205
6-Iron 180-190
7-Iron 165-180
8-Iron 150-170
9-Iron 140-155
Pitching Wedge 130-135
Sand Wedge 115-120
Lob Wedge 75-95

David Marshall

I can definately vouch for the figures that Paul Mason shows. I played a couple of rounds with him in The Algarve, and he blasts the ball. Drove 1 green 310 metres, using a driver (naturally).

Then there is The Shrek aka Danny Brant. I have played with him a couple of times. His distances are around the average PGA Tour players. But, in his own words, he has no short game whatsoever.

My distances..Take the womens average and knock 20% off that 

John Pettitt

Terry, I know you are sceptical about some of the claims for distances hit with a seven iron, but todays younger brethren do seem to be able to hit the ball a long way and some on this forum can do exactly that.

I stand by my claim that mine goes 140 yds.

Terry Wall

Quite right, John, and don't we know it! A regular partner of mine holed-in-one at our 11th off the yellow tees (160 yards) with a pitching wedge, and lipped out the next week off the white tee (190) with a 9-iron!

I tried to post a reply on another thread giving a method of assessing what club to take but it seemed to get lost.

Fundamentally it involves taking four irons to a flat practice ground (maybe a 3, 5, 7 and 9 iron) and hitting differently numbered balls with each club, then pacing out the real yardages. You then find out how far you actually hit each club - coupled with clubbing for the BACK of the green (away from danger) - this can only be good for your scores.

All you need then is some patter to justify taking a 4-iron when your playing partners are taking 7's! ("I prefer to punch my irons" is my favourite). If I'm closer to the pin, what do I care!

Thanks for your knowledgeable submissions - what's this about your game declining with age: are you in your nineties? I'm improving at 64.

Danny Brant

John Pettitt

Terry, it is great that you are still playing to such a high standard at 64, I too was still playing off 6 when I was 62, then I suffered a heart attack, followed by everything else that can go wrong with a heart. I am now fitted with an ICD and have been returned to golf for the past year, although I am disappointed that I have not been able to recapture the standard that I felt I would be able to.

None of this is due to the heart apart from my strength, just the fact that my right knee right hip and lower back have all seized up and I cannot swing very far back and I find it very difficult to get off the right side into a good follow through, which as you well know gives height to the shot.

My friend at my club is 76 , five years older than me and hits the ball as if he were 26 but he suffers from nothing, so he is fortunate, as it seems, you are, and long may it continue.

I see you are in my neck of the woods, so perhaps we could arrange a game together sometime.

Having played with Danny, I too can vouch for the ridiculous distances he sends the ball with every club, why he is still the handicap he is I just cannot believe.

Jonny P

I hit mine 155.

A lot of people seem to be questioning others distances - I think a lot of the time, especialy with higher handicap players they have thier hands setup way ahead of the ball at address thus delofting the club turning a 7 iron into a 5 iron.

 ddddd

John Pettitt

Having the hands in front of the club does not necessarily deloft it. I have my hands in front on a seven iron, but the face is not closed. Ball flight height is determined by the follow through, or lack of it.

My experience tells me that the higher handicaps hit the ball way to high. If a ball  is hit very high, it is more difficult to judge the distance. I much prefer a lower ball flight, always have.

Keith Bailey

John,

I must disagree with your comments above.  A high ball flight is what most people are after (unless you play on links, in which case low is good).  The ball goes high because it is struck down on, compressing it in to the ground and creating lots of back spin.  Back spin is what makes it climb high.

I am a tall person (6 5" and have always hit the ball high and long.  I hit a 7 iron 165 in this current weather and 180 in summer.  I have to add though that I have practiced hitting the ball low to make sure that I can do this when I need to, but rarely use it.  There are varied opinions on weather being able to hit long is of any real benefit, I feel that there is some but not as much as some may think.  My brothers game is a complete contrast to mine and doesnt hit very far at all but his handicap is lower and I really struggle to beat him because he is so consistent.

Always remember, the card doesnt tell a story and nobody will know or care weather you hit 7 iron or 4 iron if you romp home with 40 points.

Terry Wall

Wise words, Keith - and nobody cared this morning when I romped home with 29 points either! Still, a few good shots so I'll be back next week.

On the subject of length - I wonder if this is down to an automatic use of hands? The one element of the swing that will accelerate the clubhead to high speed (which, after all, is the only way to hit the ball a long way) is the ability, whether "instinctive" or learned, to use a lot of hand action. Having been taught in the 50's I use a very simple body turn to hit the ball, but this gives very little action in the hitting zone. However, it is accurate, and that still counts for a lot in golf. Naturally I wish I were longer but would only trade 1 yard of lost accuracy for ten yards of extra distance. As I'm a good fairway wood player I actually like - and win - on courses with many 400+ yard par-4s.

So, what's the answer? Trial and error, I think - hit lots of golf balls, learn where they go with different clubs and apply that knowledge to your shots on the course. Apart from that, practise your short game and putting. There you go - 5 handicap max.

John P - a game would be a delight, where and when? I'm at Royal Winchester, where are you?

p.s. to all - Royal Winchester has a very good deal expiring end March - a fourball for £80 including a snack meal. Ring Andrew Buck on 01962-852462 and tell him I suggested it to you (actually he will give you the deal anyway, but I like him to give my society good deals!).

John Pettitt

David Marshall

John Pettitt

Keith, you have every right to disagree, but what you state is completely incorrect. Striking down on the ball does not, in itself, hit a high shot, the high shot can only come with a full follow through.

Please describe how you keep the ball, low, then perhaps I may understand how you approach this game.

With the armoury at your disposal I would be a scratch golfer again.

John Pettitt

David Marshall

Yes I know John...But every time you ask, it is either pissing it down or blowing a hoolie.

And you know I don't like getting wet and cold !!

John Pettitt

David Marshall

John Pettitt

David Marshall

O.K. then John...

Golfshake have a Northern Cup event on 9th June. Somewhere in the wilderness of Yorkshire.

Lets look into having a Southern match, call it what you will, around the same time at South Winchester. That gives us exactly 3 months to organise something 

John Pettitt

Keith Bailey

John,

Spin on the ball is what takes the 'normal' trajectory of a ball flight and makes it even higher, hence striking down on the ball to create back spin will make the ball climb very high.  I have a natural steep approach to the ball as I am tall, hence I have always hit the ball high.  To keep the ball low, I try to make my approach to the ball flatter rather than steep.  If you imagine that my normal swing shape is a V (to take it to an extreme) and when I wish to hit the ball low I change it to more of a U shape.  I coupld this with taking a less lofted club and making a 70-80% swing.  So if I have say 180 to the pin and its blowing a gail, then instead of hitting a 6-7 iron, I would take a 5 iron and make an easier U shaped swing.

The one truly great thing about hitting your shots high is that once you have figured out how long you hit each club and in any given situation, you can hit your shot straight at the pin (hopefully) and it will fall from high int he sky with almost no spin and stop straight away.  Most would agree that Titleist Pro V1 are the best balls to use and one of their biggest selling points is "drop and stop" ability.

Although I play off 12.7, I have been told on many occasions that I have the wood and iron game of a much lower handicapper, unfortunately I have coupled this with the putting ability of a crazy golfer.

John Pettitt

You are wrong, Keith, I can strike the ball firmly downwards and produce a very low flying shot and produce backspin. Height is only achievable by a fast impact speed and a good follow through.

It is also well know that the higher one hits the ball the more difficult it is to guage the forward distance.

If you say that you know exactly how far each of you clubs go then your handicap should be lower.

Pro V1's are a ball that requires a strong impact speed to get the benefit from them, it is a good players ball, but if you ever play with me you will see that I play with a balata ball, as I always have, it is cheap and nasty but I am able to stop this without any problems whatsoever and I am quite sure that those members on here who have played with me will confirm this.

I would have like you to have seen an old friend of mine who played for Essex, a scratch golfer, he used to hit 9 irons into the green so low that one always thought they were going to take one bounce and disappear off the back of the green, they used to take the one bounce and then check like mad, quite amazing to watch.

The leading edge of the club is what makes contact with the ball first whilst it is descending, the club then carries on to take the divot. It is this action that gives the ball backspin and the reason most golfers cannot do it, is because they hit the ball with the face of the club first instead of the leading edge.

You have no need to alter your swing to hit the ball low, all that is required is for the ball to moved further back in the stance and the follow through restricted. If you can hit a five iron into a gale on a 180 yard shot you are of the calibre of our own Mr Danny Brant, who also has the most enormous potential I have ever seen.

Danny Brant

John Pettitt

Keith Bailey

Sorry John, I'm still disagreeing with you.  I can hit a ball high with almost no 'through' swing, why? because I strike down on the ball, compress it, creating back spin and making it climb.  I am aware of the shot you are speaking about (with your friend) as Padraig Harrington hits a similar shot (not with a 9 iron though) that comes in low, bounces once then checks up immediately.

With regards to having my handicap lower, I can only say that it is almost entirely due to my putting, which varies between "bad" and "oh my god I'm embarassed that other people saw that".  Although my handicap is 12.7 it should in fact be lower.  I only joined my club back in July 07 having previously calculated my own (and my friends) handicaps, where I played off 9.  My handicap is slowly coming down and I expect to be back in the region of 9-10 by the end of the year.

I have had many people tell me that I have the driving and iron game of a great golfer and the chipping and putting of a complete novice.  I have to ashamedly agree.  My games are normally best described as many missed opportunities for par, eagle, birdie etc.  I have recently worked quite a bit on my chipping and putting and there are improvements, my chipping has imrpoved an awful lot but the putting is much tougher for me.  My aim is to be around the 5 mark within 2 years, hopefully I will achieve it.

John Pettitt

Sorry, Keith, impossible with no follow through.

If you are ever going to attain five handicap then it will not take two years. 

John Pettitt

Sorry, Keith, impossible with no follow through.

If you are ever going to attain five handicap then it will not take two years. 

Keith Bailey

David Marshall

Perhaps Keith you may hit the ball with more weight on your right side.

Knowing me I might be wrong. But when I need to get the ball up very quickly, to clear bushes or trees etc, I put the majority of the weight on my right side with the ball further back in my stance and hit down and through with very little follow through (around 11 o'clock position) and the ball goes very high

John Pettitt

David Marshall

John...

Keith may want to play at South Winchester !

Including Danny, we already have a fourball 

John Pettitt

Well, David, I have just decided that I have been playing this game all wrong, because if I want to get the ball up quickly then I play it off the front foot, break the wrists early on the backswing and then make sure that I have a high follow through.

If I used your method then the ball would not get very high.

Keith may want to join us all at South Winchester if it is not too far for him to travel. 

David Marshall

John Pettitt

David, if you want to go against all the recognised teaching on this subject, then be my guest, I was just saying what everyone who can play this game does. It is now obvious that both you and Keith are quite unique in the methods that you use and that we are now never going to agree on what is the correct method.

This of course does not mean that you are not my friend and that I will be looking for a demonstration the next time we play.

David Marshall

John Pettitt

The only way for them to have gone high was for you to have followed through strongly, hitting and stopping will not put the ball very high.

We did spend a lot of time in the sand at Donnington, didn't we.

You were pretty solid with both the driver and the fairway woods.

David Marshall

John Pettitt

Any follow through that has finished with the hands higher than the shoulders can be considered to be pretty full IMO, so 11.o'clock is pretty much a high follow through, most certainly not a hit and stop.

Not really worth arguing about, though, David. You are happy with your method and I am happy with mine, who is to say what is right or wrong, it is the finished result that matters most.

John Standing

I'd be interested in a game at Winchester John if you need more people to make up a society day.

Played at the East Dorset Country club yesterday and despite the high winds, torrential rain for about 4 holes it was a great course. I could have won the day if it hadn't been for my putting (40 putts, bad bad bad). Tricky undulating quick greens that i never got the pace of all day!

Ruined my card at the end too, by going for a 135 yard par 3 with an eight iron, which is right at the top end of my range...pulled it left...the right to left wind then took my ball further left into the gorse, from there lobbed into a bunker and never got out. Very frustrating...should have take an easy 7 which i hit about 145

...there i got back on topic in the end:-)

Always like to playing new courses though.

John Pettitt

You are welcome anywhere, anytime, John, you know that. I put myself down for your day at the Hampshire but I noticed that it was stuck on five for a long while so I dropped back out again, that was the only reason, so if more come along I will re-enter.

Sorry to hear about your putting, cmon 40 putts is disgraceful. 135 yds with an eight iron would be too far for me, but hopefully you will have learned from it. If you felt you were in for a shout, off your handicap you should have played the percentage, but Heh we all do it, don't we.

You will like South Winchester it is a very nice course with some great holes and a super finishing hole par five dogleg left, downhill with a small lake guarding the green.

David Marshall

I saw that you were not available for that game John P, otherwise I would have put my name down.

So if you put your name down, then I will too 

John Pettitt

It is on Good Friday, David and I played in Johns event there before, so I naturally put my name down, but as there seemed to be no more interest and with 5 being an odd number and me being the last to subscribe, I though it best to leave it as a four.

Now if, I see your name there then I will put mine down as we can then split into two 3 balls.

David Marshall

John Pettitt

John Standing

Great see you both there.

I will be able to book the tee times tomorrow. I've reduced the numbers to 8 so we''ll see what happens. The other player Roly has a no show rate of 50%...

John Pettitt

Tim Hawkins

Danny Brant

Pat Fitzsimons

David Marshall

Tim Hawkins

David Marshall

Ermm...

I seem to remember you had the monopoly on that trick Tim.   I was more bunkers and blind shots, as I recall 

Jason Brooke

Guys Im 5ft 5inches tall (or small) and I hit my 7 iron to the 175yd tire at the local range in the summer.

 I played on Sunday and hit my 7 iron of my winter fairway mat 170yds wind behind to the middle of the green.

 Our assistant pro calls me "sneaky long".

 I don't swing hard or fast, so it must just be in the timing.  I am self taught and have played football all my life so have very strong legs.

I could never hit this far when I was 17/18, it just seemed to sneak up on me over the last 10 years, I'm 36 now. 

Robbie Allison

Ah..Your secrets out "sneaky long"

Ya kick it...!!

NWOT....

Jonny P

Tiger hits an average of 158 with an 8 Iron - so his 7 iron is less than most of the claims on this thread

Dave Knatt

John Flood

Howard Lockhart

average 7 iron is 160 -165 on a wind free day.

i play corrie fisted so keeps the flight slightly lower

Jason Brooke

"Tiger hits an average of 158 with an 8 Iron - so his 7 iron is less than most of the claims on this thread "

I've seen Tiger hit his 7 iron over 200yds, Im sure my average is way down when it boils down to it.  It all depends whether it is uphill, downhill, upwind, downwind etc etc.

Its a well known fact that pros hit well within themselves, on average 80%, I dont know about you but I rip it up at 100%, Im not good enough to lose 20%, I also only hit it straight, the pros can hit full high fades into a wind and the full shot will only go 130-140yds with a 7 iron, yet if they want to draw a ball into a green they could then be hitting it way way further.

Its not about how far you hit the club, its getting the job done, nobody cared on Sunday that I hit my drive into some bushes on 9, chipped over the back of the green, thinned a chip 30ft away and then canned a putt for a par, the card says 4 and thats all Im bothered about.

I play with the Leeds and Yorkshire U18 captain who plays off 1.  He is always 2 irons less than me even though we tend to drive a similar distance, so on our par3 12th which is 170yd elevated tee I hit 8iron he hits wedge, I dont try match him I try get my ball inside his....simple as that. 

John Pettitt

Danny Brant

John Pettitt

Jason Brooke

Ive been playing golf since I was 10 and he is the best player I have ever seen. Our last hole is a par 5 uphill, usually plays into the wind 540yds, late last August we were the only ones left on the course, so, messing about we had a 3 iron only comp, he ripped 2 3 irons about 50yds of the green, then played a 50yd runner onto a tough 2 tier green to 2ft and canned the putt for a birdie, all with his 3 iron.

To be honest its not the distance he hits the ball thats impressive its the variety of shots and the accuracy that goes with it.

Keep an eye out for the name Richard Law, he's gonna be good, trust me.

John Pettitt

Jason Brooke

John Pettitt

Jason Brooke

Well this winter in our Saturday school you get docked a shot if you win, they docked him to 0, then he won again so was off +1.

Summer cannot come quick enough now!!!!!!!!

Jonny P

Aye that's just Tigers average Jason - certainly not his maximum.

John Laverick

I reguarly smack mine 200 yards,  anyone at our golf club who plays with me for the  first  time is astonished  at how far I hit with all my clubs.

BUT, I chip a ball like a man with no arms, just can't do it!!!! I can drive a ball 300yds+ and be only 10 foot or so from the green on a par 4, guaranteed I'll duff the chip. So i don't think it matters how far you hit them it's how close to the target, and it's the second shot that counts.

My long hitting used to mess with the heads of the blokes I was playing with and they would try and out hit me and cock thier game up. now they know me they just say "don't matter he'll duff his chip" and most of the time, sadly they are right.

Ho Hum, on  with the chipping practice

John

Jonny P

Kevin Hewitt

Hi John,

I don't quite hit the ball as far is you do but I do hit the ball far - with a 7-iron I can comfortably hit around 170+ yards in perfect conditions, and I can probably hit my 3 Wood as far as most players hit their driver!!

I think that best way to handle the extra distance and power is to tame it, i.e. club down more off the tee. For instance in the summer on my home coures the second hole is a 550 yard par 5 and I will tee off with a 3-iron, then 7-iron second and a sw into the green. You don't need to use Driver off the tee unless its absolutely necessary, usually on the longer par 4s and par 5s. The short game isn't as critical if you are hitting fuller approach shots intop the green.

John Pettitt

I cannot believe that with all this awesome power why on earth no one is playing off scratch.

If I started 300 yds down the fairway I would be shooting par or better, that's for sure.

Chris Perry

One word for you John - accuracy.  As John said above, "i don't think it matters how far you hit them it's how close to the target, and it's the second shot that counts". 

I think short game is crucial (crucially lacking for me).  If I took three to the green on a par 4 but my third shot was a wedge from 30 odd yards and I could drop it within a couple of feet then I would probably make par.  If my second shot were from the same place due to a booming drive but my short game was poor I would probably need at least two putts and maybe an additional chip.  Especially if that booming drive was not in a good place or in the rough. 

Jonny P

On a side note - an easy way to check your exacty yardages is to use google maps in satelite mode and plot the distance from the tee to a place you know you cregulary drive.

If I catch a sweet one on 18 I can drive right next to a big tree in the middle of the fairway.

I plotted this on google maps and it's bang on 250. I told my playing partners this and they were convinced when I hit a big'un it's 300 yards.

I think the modern ball and the way it pings off the modern driver is quite deceiving - you can look like a big driver but the figures can say otherwsie.

John Laverick

John,

trust me, it's a constant comment I get off my fellow players,  "sort your chipping out and you'll be off scratch" as I walks off the course scratching my head wondering why I've been beaten by one of the seniors off 18?

Kevin, you've hit the nail on the head for this year. especially my course, very much a thinkers course and designed to punish the big hitter!! so why do I do it? I must say there's some great satisfaction brought out of standing on the 1st Tee on comp day and  driving the ball onto a par 4 green in front of the club house, but that won't win me any comps because as you say there is  far too much that can go wrong, especially as we have out of bounds on the the left and right.

 No I'm going to rain it in and do exactly as you say kevin, I'm much more comfortable hitting an iron 150 yds from the green than I am chipping from 10 yds f rom the green.

It's just a macho thing that I find hard to control.

I'll get there,

John

Jonny P

Man I'd go for the green every time

John Pettitt

These days most of the holes are just too long for me to reach in regulation figures, this means that any attempt to go for it brings into play all the usual trouble that surrounds greens these days, bunkers, water and deep rough, so I have had to change my thinking.

I now much prefer to play these holes as three shotters, but making sure that I have a full shot into the green. At the end of the round it is what you have scored that is important and no one is interested how you got them.

Kevin Hewitt

Robbie Allison

My game sounds very much like John's. I like to get into position for my 3rd shot to the green and then 1 or 2 putt.

Bogey golf gets me a 90 at my course and if I scrape a par or 2 enroute well that's me happily in the 80's.

I admire the better player though who can go for the greens in 2 with success but due to the time I can afford to my hobby they will always be out of my league.

 NWOT.....

Jonny P

No way - if you can hit it that long you can take an iron off the tee which will keep under the wind better and be easier to control than a driver and STILL be up with your mates who have taken driver.

If you ask me it's much easier playing wedge into a green than it is 6 iron, it's as easy as that.

John Laverick

kevin,

couldn't agree more, the person who hits it 200yds knows that's all he has in his bag for that hole and he deals with it cos he has no choice.

Me I can stand on the same hole and have a choice of 4 different clubs to hit. once you put choices in my head I start thinking of the what ifs, and when I come to take my shot, on the down swing I'm thinking "should have used my 3 wood" and bang I'm in trouble. I know someones going to say,reduce your clubs and have less choice but, I like using all my clubs if I can, I get a lot of enjoyment of being able to use all the clubs in my bag, more than having a good score sometimes.

 The wind, the wind!!! I hit my clubs high wihich is probably why I get the distance, but in the wind, a slight hook or push ends up as being this horrendous arcing ball that travels for miles into the farmers field.

As for my problems with the chipping,I only have one, I can't chip!! what it is is this, Because I hit the ball with a fair strike everytime, when it comes to chipping As I  come through the shot I think "I'm  going to hit this too hard" and I quit, When i do catch it right It's a great shot and I'm well chuffed but I always think it as being a fluke as opposed to being planned! Think I'll start closing my eyes, see what happens then (or not)

Any tips on chipping?/

John

John Pettitt

Perhaps my thoughts on this game are out of tune with modern thinking, but to me, a chip has always been a shot that is played when close to the green but no hazards in the way. This is then just a putt with a lofted club, really a simple shot and one that anyone should be able to get a feel for. Bump and runs are also one of my favourite shots and if used regularly quickly develops a feel for distance, and after all is said and done, this game is all about judgement of distance.

A pitch, on the other hand is one that I would use when I am faced with a hazard in front of me and it is dependent on how much green I have to work with as to which of my four wedges I use.

I too, at one time, used to attack everything, when I had the capability, but over the years I have learned that sometimes it is better to try and curb these animal instincts and play the percentages. Now of course I have no choice, I really have to think my way round.

Jonny P

Kevin Hewitt

John 

Regarding chipping - there are two ways to play high or low, the high route is using a SW or LW all of the time and trying to carry it to the hokle or the low route for which you can use several diffreent clubs and you try to get the ball rolling earlier and sue the release of the ball once it is on the green to get it near the hole.

I prefer the low route my self because I feel much more in control of the shot as the swing is similar to putting - a bit like a very long put, and I sometimes prefer to chip from the fringe of the green if I am a long way from the hole.

Hope this helps.

John Laverick

Kevin,

unfortunately I have no choice other than to use the long route, however my course doesn't always lend itself to that style of play and when I arrive at a green and my ball is in front of a bunker for instance, then instant panic sets in. I literally begin to flap. I can go on the practice green and chip/pitch onto the green all day, soon as I get on the course I lose all rational thought and turn into jelly!! I know It's all in my head, because I have the ability.

Another problem I have is on comp day. I turn up with the attitude, "all I have to do is play within myself and I'll win this today" and straight away I've put the pressure on.

Just can't get over them two stumbling blocks,

Right I'm off to talk to the white rabbitts!!!

John

Jon T

160 yards, though I use bladed clubs, so requires a pure centre of the clubhead strike, else I lose a good few yards.

John Laverick

J P,

how do I use Google in the sattellite mode to measure distances?

John

John Laverick

I sussed it,

Thanks

David Marshall

Tim Hawkins

Danny James

John Pettitt

Tim Hawkins

Jonny P

Google Earth is very accurate - I tested it against a course guide from Woburn and it gives the same distances as shown in the book.

Jonny P

Danny James

I learnt to count at school....

seriously. 350+yrds?

Danny James

John Pettitt

Jonny P

Sorry Danny my bad - it was the other Danny that said he often hits 350+

I'll crawl back under my rock..  

Robbie Allison

I tend to pace on every hole from the 150 marker. Further away from the green I have a gestimate as to the distance left for my wedge into the green shot which, is usually 60 yards.

 NWOT........

Danny James

Let me explain a little clearer.

IF I wanted to know how far I had hit the ball. I would pace to it.

I dont pace to the flag/target. Thats just stupid.

If I wanted to know how far to go, like Robbie, I use the markers.

John Pettitt

Jason Brooke

I tend to pace from 150yds to my ball, i.e stand on the 150 marker and then count down, I tend to guesstimate the other way because John is right, it takes time and the last thing my playing partners need is some pretentious 10 handicapper taking all day wondering whether its 176 or 177 yds to the pin only to pull it into a bunker.  Common sense prevails me thinks eh!!!!!

Nure Rahman

Jason Brooke

Just been on google earth to check yardages, very interesting, I thought I'd absolutely creamed my drive on 17, wind behind, when in actual fact it only went 275yds.  I agree with John Laverick, my handicap SHOULD in the opinion of my buddies, be lower, if you watch my swing and see where the ball goes.  But my tendency last year was, if I missed a green, I was chipping and then 2 putting, either because my chip was crap or my putting was crap. Since the last medal (October 07) I have read a couple of books by Bob Rotella and got one as an audiobook on my Ipod.

His main point in all books is love your wedges and putter.  

I have spent the whole winter practising my chipping, pitching and putting, not only the actual physical exercise on the range but the mental side of it and it really is starting to pay off.

This year so far, I have won more money in our schools at the weekend.  My scores are more in the 70's than the 80's and that is playing off winter tees, no run on the fairways, greens that have been sandbanded and we also have to use a small astroturf mat from the fairways oh and the ball isnt flying as far.

Some people are particularly cynical regarding the mental side of the game and that is fair enough, but I have spent years and hundreds of pounds on gadgets and books and dvds trying to perfect my swing and yet in the last 4 or 5 months my game has improved more by sorting the bit out between my ears.

You can get Bob Rotella books dirt cheap from Amazon and they are dirt cheap as some are 2nd hand.

Ill be interested to hear your responses.

Jason Brooke

Just been on google earth to check yardages, very interesting, I thought I'd absolutely creamed my drive on 17, wind behind, when in actual fact it only went 275yds.  I agree with John Laverick, my handicap SHOULD in the opinion of my buddies, be lower, if you watch my swing and see where the ball goes.  But my tendency last year was, if I missed a green, I was chipping and then 2 putting, either because my chip was crap or my putting was crap. Since the last medal (October 07) I have read a couple of books by Bob Rotella and got one as an audiobook on my Ipod.

His main point in all books is love your wedges and putter.  

I have spent the whole winter practising my chipping, pitching and putting, not only the actual physical exercise on the range but the mental side of it and it really is starting to pay off.

This year so far, I have won more money in our schools at the weekend.  My scores are more in the 70's than the 80's and that is playing off winter tees, no run on the fairways, greens that have been sandbanded and we also have to use a small astroturf mat from the fairways oh and the ball isnt flying as far.

Some people are particularly cynical regarding the mental side of the game and that is fair enough, but I have spent years and hundreds of pounds on gadgets and books and dvds trying to perfect my swing and yet in the last 4 or 5 months my game has improved more by sorting the bit out between my ears.

You can get Bob Rotella books dirt cheap from Amazon and they are dirt cheap as some are 2nd hand.

Ill be interested to hear your responses.

John Pettitt

Are you related to this Rotella fella, Jason.

Yes I am one of the cynical ones, as I feel I don't need anyone to tell me how to play the game as I mastered it when I was a young man, quite easily. Managed to win quite a few tournaments, so my mental capacity must have been fine.

I doubt you will be interested to hear this response.

Danny Brant

I think the mental side is massive in most sports, but especially golf. I think thats because it's you and the course, very easy to implode.

If you play rugby and your not doing to well, you have an opponent to channel your frustration/aggression on, one big tackle and you feel right as rain again. You have no such luxuries on a golf course.

I hope that made sense. 

John Laverick

It's all in the head, 90% mental and 10% skill no doubt about it. I'll get me one of those books Jason and get back to you in a coule of months.

John

Jason Brooke

I wish I was related then I could get 1st hand help rather than reading books.  Its very interesting, I played football from the age of 8 till last year when my body said enough and to a very good standard and I never doubted myself and even if you werent at your confident best hard work usually masked a bad display, but with golf its completely different.

I used to throw clubs, lose my temper and let a bad hole fester inside me like a smoldering fire...a few years later and some careful reading and I find I never ever let my anger continue for more than the "20 yard line" yes that is a Tigerism but hey he is the top of the tree so he must be doing something right.

A lot of what the books say will start to sound just like common sense really, but its ideals that you will forget when, in the heat of a tournament things might have gone a bit wrong.

I now find I focus more on every shot I play rather than thinking about the past or the future.  I tend not to keep score, so instead of thinking, "If I can par the last 3 I will have broken 80" I just play the holes and add up when Ive finished.

I enjoy the game more than I ever did, I enjoy the company I keep rather than thinking Ill play better if I remain focused and dont speak much to anyone, now chatting and having a laugh helps keep my mind clear.

I am at the moment working on my putting as this is the weakness of my game, Ive stopped working on my technique as I have realised that I am not actually a bad putter , I just think I am, if that makes sense.

I've stopped worrying about 3 putting, if I do I do, its not the end of the world, my preshot putting routine is a lot quicker now, no more final checks, then last minute thoughts over the ball, its now preshot routine, eyes down and away we go.

Its coming, slowly but surely, I still have a tendency to try too hard when Im not playing that well.  I try hit it too hard, get too quick, rather than relaxing and excepting what kind of day Im going to have, but now, I actually enjoy grinding and almost feel better when I come off the course playing to my handicap when its been a real struggle.

Its easy to think its mumbo jumbo but I think to realise your full potential in anything you want to do well you have to keep an open mind. 

Jonny P

You sound like a Bob Rotella book Jason - a good thing in my opinion, helped me massivly too and made the game a lot ore enjoyable.

John Pettitt

Jason, maybe I was brought up in an era when there was no such thing as pressure, as I cannot relate to anything you have just said, apart from being able to grind out a score when not playing too well.

Do you honestly believe that if every Pro golfer or even amateur applied the teachings of this book that they would all achieve the same standard in this game. Of course they wouldn't, those who know how to win would still be at the top, even though some of them do not have the natural ability of those not winning.

I don't throw clubs, never have and never will. I know when I am playing well, and when those days arrive, I seem to have a natural ability to maintain it all throughout the round. Those days when things are not right, I take as just one of those days and spend the whole round working on different things, searching for something, but never getting to the stage where I am depressed or feeling the need to go to a shrink.

If you are getting all het up in a tournament at your current standard, then I don't think you will ever be able to cope with playing in a scratch tournament, no matter how many books you read.

Confidence comes with ability and I think you would be far better off getting your ability levels raised in your game first. I feel you are brainwashing yourself into believing that you will improve just by reading this book. After all is said and done, if you master all the techniques and advice from this book it will not improve the standard of your physical play.

Why is it that the modern world likes to blame everything on the pressures of today. I have always felt that pressure, stress, call it what you like, is self induced. Perhaps it is me that is out of kilter with this thinking, I don't know, as I never have worried about anything in my life.

Problems are there to be overcome, if they cannot be overcome, then they are no longer a problem.

Kevin Hewitt

Well said John - I couldn't have put it better.

A bad at the office is a bad day at the office, and in the end you just have to get on with it. I tend to remember that I'm playing mainly for enjoyment and I enjoy every gane of golf that I play, I just enjoy the rounds that I play well more than those that I play badly. It's a frustrating game but never to the extent of throwing clubs/tantrums on the course - I couldn't afford to throw clubs anyway LOL

BUT - I do find those who habitually throw clubs and make four word utterances during the round a bit off-putting.

Chris Perry

I'm not a club thrower, but I do have problems with the mental side of things.  Biggest problem I have is that if I have a bad shot, I start chasing the hole to recover it, which then causes me to make poor decisions and have a bad hole.  I know I should just accept it, take my medicine and forget it but I don't.  Curiously, this only affects me if it's a duffed shot as I have no problems accepting a chip out of the trees as a necessity.  One good shot and it's all good again. 

I know what my problem is and it's my inability to forget the last shot (those who played with me at Breadsall Manor last year saw how far my head dropped when things started going wrong).  I need to learn how to say "Ce la vie" and get on with the next shot. 

David Marshall

I used to play with a guy who would throw his clubs, even wrapped one round a tree once, he would shout and swear, eventually I just had to stop playing with him. Apparently he still does it....

Like Kevin, I just like to play golf. Even though my bad days at the office seem to happen more often than not.  Perhaps I should just fire myself ! 

Chris Perry

I used to play with a guy who took the following routine: -

1 bad shot - swear

2 consecutive bad shots - swear and throw club

3 consecutive bad shots - swear, throw club, kick bag repeatedly until trolley falls over, ignore everyone for next hole. 

Used to make us much more relaxed as we laughed about it behind his back.

Kevin Hewitt

We do have some quite viscious club throwers at my club, one in particular was so annoyed about mising one put too many that he throw the putter up a tree and in didn't come down and so had to complete the comp with his rescue club. And on another day the gang that I was playing with were hihgly amused as the course was littered with pristine graphite Ping shafts in various states of disrepair from the same player!!

I just don't understand these people.

Jonny P

If I played with someone who did that, that match would be my last one with him.

We all curse bad shots, but someone who lets it drag on for more than 30 seconds just ruins it for everyone else. These guys really woudl benefit form some sports (or general) physchology.

Robbie Allison

I just don't understand these people.

They sound very much like "tossers" to me...

Tossing clubs indeed.

Only two things in life should be tossed and one is pan cakes..

NWOT.....

Kevin Hewitt

Jason Brooke

John,

I never once mentioned stress and the pressure of everyday life.  A family member suffers from severe depression, is on strong medication etc etc and I cannot relate to this illness in any way as I am happy go lucky and see the glass as ALWAYS half full.

I have what some would consider a stressful job, yet I enjoy it, it never gets me down and as soon as Im home the day is forgotten about and I look forward to the next day. 

These days ALL the top pros employ a shrink, hence Bob Rotella on the range with Ernie Els at the last PGA tour event. Tiger is the biggest exponent of the mind game, hence his twirls and manorisms after goods shots, its all part of his mental game.

There is nothing wrong with my technique, I know I am a good golfer, I do get nervous on the 1st tee before a medal or big comp, I do not want to be a world beater at golf, I just want to be the best that I can be. I can play to scratch when Im playing well and to 18 and above when Im not, I know through experience that the bad rounds are down to trying too hard rather than bad technique.

I think its a very narrow minded attitude to take to dismiss different teaching methods, the brain is a powerful tool, its a scientific fact that we only realise about 10% of its full potential.

Im not saying this is the right way or the wrong way, Im not trying to advertise any books products or persons in particular, I was trying to give my life experience to someone who, by the sounds of it is going through something similar to myself in respect of his short game. 

John Pettitt

Jason 

So you honestly believe that employing a shrink is all we need to do to be good at this game yet I don't consider good to be anything above 2 handicap.

It is not narrow minded to dismiss different teaching techniques if I don't agree with them.

You contradict yourself by saying that there is nothing wrong with your technique, yet your handicap refutes this,at the same time admitting you get nerves on the first tee.

I had nerves on the first tee once, when I thought I could play the game, having got down to four handicap in seven months from taking the game seriously. I entered the Essex Amateur Championships (Max handicap 4) which was held that particular year at Romford. I walked onto the 1st tee and as I pegged up ready to play, the starter announced "Quiet please, John Pettitt, Chingford Golf Club on the tee. At this point my legs just turned to jelly, something which I had never encountered before, but somehow I managed to get the ball away safely. I have never suffered from that since and I have played in far more important competitions than that one. I just cannot imagine getting stressed out on the tee about a club competition. That may be the difference between us, Jason.

If you honestly believe that your bad rounds are not down to poor technique the you are deluding yourself.

Incidently it is not my short game that is causing me problems.

I might add that if you can shoot par on occasion and then play to 18 handicap at other times, then perhaps you may have mental problems in respect of golf, but only a good technique will provide the consistency you are obviously striving for.

I hope that you do achieve your goals, Jason, as I like to see everyone play this game well.

John Pettitt

Kevin, we played together at Donnington on a tough day and as you well know your own game was not functioning as it should have done for your handicap over the front nine holes.

I really admired the way you stuck at the task of trying to get your game back in order, and this was reflected with a great second half performance under those tough conditions.

I struggled to get off the tee all the way round but I never gave up trying. No book in the world could have improved our performances that day.

Kevin Hewitt

Too right John - the best way to approach this game mentally is to just look forward not back and hope things get better when you're having a mare.

A trick I always try is to treat every tee shat as if you are on the first tee if things are going off the rails, and it usually works for me....eventually.

Jonny P

Jason Brooke

Most of the pros these days employ, coaches, shrinks, personal trainers, dieticians, they have all raised the bar somewhat.

I work on my all round game a couple of times a week at the range, but I know my limitations, I miss greens, I probably hit about 60% per round and the thing that has in the past let me down the most when Im struggling is my short game. When I can play level par I may hit a few more greens but I get up and down and dont 3 putt, vice versa when its 18 over, with maybe the odd OB thrown in for good measure.

I dont depend on my books, but they have helped, particularly with my putting.

I've been a member (again) at my club for only 12 months now, I was a junior and got down to 6 but the football always came first so I stopped playing until about 4 years ago, when some of my footy mates wanted to play golf in the summer.

Since rejoining I found at first I was really intimidated when playing with somebody who was low single figures and my game went to pot, when trying too hard I tend to overswing and this throws everything out of sync so I spray it around a bit.

I suppose John its horses for courses.  Playing at the level you have done, I can see why nothing phases you now and I envy the level you have played at.

Things have got better over the past 12 months, hence the reason Im looking forward to the 08 season and have set myself a goal of halving my handicap by the end of the year.  A big ask I know, but I like a challenge. 

John Pettitt

J P, course management is at the top of my list as the first essential to good golf, but that is something that I feel I have been blessed with as I never attempt the impossible, you will never see me in the rough using a wood, for example. I have always plotted my way down a hole, even more so now that I cannot hit it very far.

Every shot requires a decision of some sort or another and yes, this is the mental side of the game, but a book is not going to say what you should do under the circumstances as every shot is different and will require different thought processes to be able to assess all the fors and againsts, that there are in making the shot a good one.  Once this decision has been made, the book is of no use as it is ones technique which will determine whether the shot is a good one or not.

Of course the brain controls everything we do in the first instance but it only works by the input we give it in the first place. 

John Pettitt

Jason, if your GIR figure is 60%, then there is no reason why you cannot get it round in level par, as the top pros stats only show 70% GIR.

Reading between the lines I feel that you are suffering from a lack of concentration at times as it appears you have tremendous ability. 

Jonny P

I agree 100% - but anything learnt from the 'book' would come in before making your swing.

I have a feeling you think it's a lot of deep mental trickery, but it really is simple stuff and most likely covers 99.9% of the things you yourself put into practise every time you play.

As a quick example a few of the good things I learnt form it are.

a) When standing on the tee, rather than just think "I'll bash this down the fairway" - I now aim at the smallest spot possible - narrowing my target and typicaly improving my accuracy. The swing hasn't chnaged by my approach to it has.

To test this I sometimes ask my playing partners where they are aiming - they say 'down the fiarway' - I ask 'where donw the fairway?' and they look puzzled.

b) When chipping or lining up a mamoth putt, I used to (as often written in golf magazines) think "I just have to get this close enough for a tap-in and I will be fine". It's the equivelent of laying up on a putt - a sports phychologist will tell you that you should try and hole it, focus on holing it not on 'getting it close' and you will simply sink more puts.

c) Hitting an approach from 160 yards with water all the way down the right a lot of golfers will stand there saying to themselves "I must not go in the water, I must not go in the water, I must not go in the water" - before long all the player is thinking about is the water, the outcome is going to be ball in water.

The brain is a very powerful tool and is easily tricked. If you have ever played matchplay against someone with (good?) gamesmanship skills you'd see this before your eyes. Seve was a genius at putting players off, disrupting their swings and causing them to make mistakes.

It really is along the same lines of that - there is no tricks in it or magic bullets, but some of the more obvious things like focusing on a small target are things that nobody has ever told me personaly but it is something that makes a world of difference to my game.

Now I really must do some work before my clients get annoyed . I should be working for Bob Rotella at this rate.

John Pettitt

OK, Jason then I am only needing the 1%  as I probably already practice what you are teaching.

a) I always pick a spot to aim at, doesn't everbody?

b)You do realise there are two schools of thought on this one and as yet statistics have not been able to prove one way or another which is the best. I am always looking to hole every putt, but then I am an optimist and fail to recognise that fact that it is never going to happen.

c) For me this is an easy one as I hit all my irons with a very slight draw and have no fear for what is on the right side of a hole. Off the tee the left side does cause me concern.

All is fair in love and war as well as matchplay, and having played more of this kind of competition that most on this forum I can agree that gamesmanship is something I have been guilty of, albeit the subtle ones. I never attempted to put a person off by doing anything physical.

As Clint would say, 'a man has to know his limitations' and this applies just as much to golf as anything else.

The impossible I can do at once, miracles take a little longer.

Now get back to work.

Dave Knatt

Sorry to go off topic, but I hit my 7 iron about 125yds

LOL

John Pettitt

Jason Brooke

John,

I think you're right and I need to try concentrate on every shot, I can be a bit carefree with my game, also the course management skills need polishing.  For instance our 3rd is about 380yds and there is a drainage ditch which requires you to carry your drive 240yds. I tended to go for it more often than not and would hit a long straight drive over the ditch roughly 50% of the time the other 50% it could go absolutely anywhere. Call it ego, matcho, whatever, since the start of this year I have taken the safer option on holes like this and laid up with a 3 wood, which has probably increased my success rate to about 85%

This time of year fairways hit isnt a big deal because the rough is virtually non existent, but I do set myself a target of 50% GIR and this is where the improvement in putting and chipping comes in.  Last Sunday I only hit 5 greens, had 3 birdies, 3 putted twice and came away with a 78 gross, I attribute this to A: Practising hard with my 8 iron down to the wedges, improving my game from 100yds down and B: Sorting my bloody head out!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 

John Pettitt

Jason, when you lay up you have taken away the chance of landing in trouble and at the same time have not dented your confidence. A longer shot is required but if you're like me the you will not find that daunting.

My course has loads of the ditches crossing the fairways and they all seem to be at places which will always catch my ball if well struck, unfortunately playing short of these all the time means I cannot reach our par fives in three shots. We have one p[ar three that is not only long but surrounded by trouble and because I get a shot there, I quite often play a wedge off the tee and then a sand wedge in. Never take more than 4 but sometimes make three. Going for it can mean a 3 or a 5.

150 yds in is the scoring zone but because most players do not play with a particular shape they can find themselves with long putts all the time, putting pressure on the putting.

You are obviously a capable golfer and think and work on your game, so I wish you luck in your endeavour to halve your handicap.

I keep my stats, not on golfshake but with another piece of software and my par scrambles are the equivalent of a five handicapper and my putting, that of a Pro, but with greens in regulation showing me as a 25 handicapper, my short game has to be good.

Dave Knatt

Mark W

Danny Brant

John. I think the mental side of golf means different things to different people.

You say I have ability to play this game well, but as you can see I played yesterday, and my handicap has gone up to 20.

I do have some ability, I mean yesterday I hit anice drive and a fantastic 5 wood, to get on this green in 2. Walked away with par [lousy 1st put] but I was happy with the way I played the hole.

But what stops me playing this way on every hole, or even near it? 

John Pettitt

Danny B, anyone can three putt and it is even more deflating after having hit two fantastic shots to reach that green, once that hole was finished, there was nothing you could do to alter the score, but it is obvious you let that unfortunate incident get to you mentally.

We must have a game soon and I will give you my thoughts on how I approach the game. It may help you, on the other hand it may not, but you never know. With your power there is not a course that would be a problem for me.

Jonny P

John Pettitt

Colin Astbury

Do you think that hole needs to some more bunkers to maybe add a little interest

John Pettitt

John Pettitt

Danny Brant

Yep John P, it's the London club. My step brother is a member there, so it's nice day out for me.

I was actually quite pleased with the way I played the hole, annoyed about the 3 putt, but overall very pleased. My point is why can I not replicate the same kind of shots on a more consistent basis?

If you notice on that round, I get purple patches in the middle of both 9's.

John Pettitt

Danny, we all know that it only requires one good shot to energise ones round, it is having the ability to keep the round going when you have hit a bad shot and then proceeded to get even worse trying to recover from it.

I looked at that round and I cannot see any purple patches, 1 three, 1 four ,7 fives and 9 sixes.

Satisfaction is something one gets from executing shots exactly as one intended to play them and you have the ability to do that more often than most.

Your short game looks as though it needs an overhaul.

Jason Brooke

Danny, I used to have "purple patches" but also the complete opposite after a bad hole it became 3 or 4 bad holes.

Now I just use the same preshot routine, forget about the last hole/shot etc and focus only on the shot in hand.

Commentators are always going on about bounce back birdies when a pro has had a bogie, but all they are doing is forgetting about the last hole and focusing on the next shot in hand, not even the next hole, just the next shot.

If you can focus on just one shot at a time, even your putting, this may help.

I tend to get ahead of myself for instance when I hit some of our shorter par 4s with my drive or get onto our par 5s in 2, its amazing when this happens how many times I 3 putt. I get carried away and think "Birdie time", worst thing you can do, get on the green and just focus on your putt.

I may work, it may not, just a bit of friendly advice. 

Danny Brant

When I mean purple patches, I mean in relation to my handicap at the moment. My goal at the moment is to be playing bogie golf, and build on that.

Also the way I was stricking the ball.

So it may not look like a purple patch with a few bogies, and a couple of pars, but believe me, it felt like it.

Jason. In my head I do all those things.

I think a lot of the time it's poor shot selection. 

Jason Brooke

Easier said than done, Danny I know.  This weekend has been a bit of a come down, ok we won the money in a betterball stableford but really struggled and today was the same, spent the whole weekend just looking for something to click.  I think Im gonna changed my 7 iron distance to 125 yards forward and 80 yards sideways.

Shot selection off 20 is vital, when I play with someone who has 2 shots on certain holes I tell them to use them, play for bogies, pars are a bonus, like John P says, even on a par 3, it may be easier to lay up with a club you feel comfortable and use your shot.

Anyway Im 1 to talk, I was laying up today without even meaning it, absolute garbage. Doesnt it just P you off!!!!!!!

Paul Calvert

In the summer with a clean hit I get a 7 iron between 185 and 190 yards - but being 6'5" and 275lbs the laws of physics have a great deal off effect here.

Coming down to lower clubs / distances therefore sets me a challenge, when your PW goes 140 yards.........

Graham Brown

I'd say about 140yds for me. I thought I didn't hit my irons very far but judging by the replies on here, I must be Mr Aerage.

A lad I play with can hit his Pitching Wedge as far as I can hit my 7 Iron and yet I can hit my driver further than him. It's something neither of us can understand. I'm further and better with my woods and he's further and better with his irons. 

Chris Grainge

Paul Everett

Alex Turner

i am very much the same paul

but it was about 130-140 but now it about 150

Darren Millichip

Graham Mclean

Colin Stephens

It's quite amazing how a simple entry on this site results in a 'mass' of comment

I feel entry here is somewhat now similar to one approaching a dead end since the subject matter has 'run it's course' but here goes anyway

I hit my 7 iron 140 yards but how often do I HIT THE TARGET !! 2/3 times out of 10 is my count !

so how many times do you hit the target with that 7 iron - Now it's your guy's go to reply to that one !

(s'funny I almost feel the need to start a new thread on the matter at these late points in the discussion)

Paul Everett

Chris Hopkins

Andy Kenyon

Graham Mclean

must come in again on this one , the density of the air does make a difference , hot days ball does fly further, cooler days cloud cover can make a difference , a warm ball in your pocket( switching after every hole )  would also make a difference , i've had some weird distances in the heat , eg: 207  yard 7 iron , proved with sat nav , i was 175 yards away from a par 5 in 2 ( to middle of green ) and completely flew the green and found the ball plugged at the back , some 32 yards past centre , so i blame the heat , ( oh and the course of steroids , lol ) happy golfing

G

Mark Burnham

Probably the most reliable and consistent club in my bag, hits 150-155yds and within 10yds left to right of the target about 9/10 times. This accuracy does not apply to other clubs where the only consistency is inconsistency...!

However after using this 20 year old half set of Pinseeker Tour irons I am awaiting the delivery of my new Callaway FTi-brids - so will have to re-assess.

Tim Hawkins

Standard density of air at sea level is 1.225kg/m2, go up 500m from this and it drops by around  5%, increase the temperature by 5C at this height and the density drops to about 1.054kg/m2 which is why it goes further.

Keeping the ball warm in your pocket has an effect on ball flight but is negligable I'm afraid, as soon as it leaves the warmth it will lose the heat immediately. Sorry. 

Patrick Bourke

 Mark, I've had these '110%' shots also and I wish I didn't. I don't know exaxtly how far I hit a 7 iron as I'm more concerned on how far I can carry a 7 iron (no wind I think between 150-170 which is a fair old variance I could do without but it does depend on how I'm striking it on that particular day and will move up or down accordingly) but if I'm near the 150 marker it's my first consideration though could be a 9 iron or a five iron depending on the shot needed.

 Tim Hawkins must have kept his ball stone cold on Sunday, playing short on the tight fairways at Thorne, with a fair old wind got him a creditable 35 points. 

Tim Hawkins

Andrew Guyton

Simon Bale

Patrick Bourke

Stuart Govan

Just back from Iceland, where playing in wind took on new meaning for me! I creamed a four iron into a headwind and it went about 75 yards!

Tim Hawkins

Graham Veitch

Lewis Gladstone-buchanan

For me this is a very interesting question....I've only just started golf but one thing I have found is that the 7 iron is my easiest club to hit well consistantly - when I'm at a par 3 150-170 yds so far I've seemed to get in around the green off the tee and the ball has gone roughly where i meant it to. Is the 7 iron an easier club to use than say 4 or 5?

I've just been suprised how consistant and for me ( a total novice !) accurate I have been with my 7

Paul Everett

What I and many others deem the 'mid' irons, 5, 6, and 7 are generally the easiest to strike consistently with.

Interestingly, many years ago, the 6 iron was my 'never fail' 'go to club'. Now with many years of manufacturers strengthening the lofts of each new addition to their catalogue I find the 7 iron now fills that position even though I consider myself a better ball striker than I was back then.

Wayne Santorini

Lewis if your swing speed was the same for every club, you'd hit everyone sweetly.

The problems some people have is that they try to hit their longer irons harder because mentally they think they have to, when in fact the loft will get you the distance.

Patrick Bourke

Lewis Gladstone-buchanan

well I'm just happy that I can hit one club straight and far !

 I've got a sometimes 'slight' sometimes 'awful' slice on my drives - and the reason is confirmed when I look at the soleplate after a session at the range....most of the time my swing is from an out to in path, this is show by the lines on the bottom. Thats what I need to get sorted quick

Danny Ruler

If there is one club in my bag that I know the exact distance that i hit it - it is the 7 iron.  Boy do I love being around those 150 yard markers! I know I can stick it 150 yards without fail (conditions permitting).

I am having a rough time with my game right now (i have only been on golfshake for 3 rounds and I average 26! I play off 19 usually) but my 7iron remains true to me.

It's my putter that is the evil one.  

Jonny P

Is there a way to unsubscribe from email alerts telling me someone has replied to this thread? I am getting loads of emails!!

PS: I hit mine 155

Sonny Jagpal

I started out hitting my 7 about 130 to 140 yards. Sometimes longer and occasionally shorter. The true measure is how far you can hit it consistantly. Having put a lot of practice in over the summer I began to hit it to 160. Now it goes 170 to 175 consitently - total carry with maybe 3-5 yards roll on top. 

Too many players worry about how far you should be hitting it or how far others hit it...it varies from person to person. 

 Only compare yourself to pro's if you play and practice everyday. 

Adam Smith

Stuart Gorton

Ross Murdoch

I would generally pull a 7 iron out on any shot within 170-180yds.

I've always been abnormal with my irons. Think it's because I'm 6'5" and use lengthened clubs (huge swing arc) 

Allan Bostock

My 7 iron has a high flight and lands at the 170-175 mark and gets no roll, but i think thats great, as it means i can fly the ball all the way to the hole (hopefully).

The main reason for the high flight is because i use Ping clubs, which are designed for high flight, due to club head design and the standard Ping shafts. Add in the fact i'm 6 foot 2" tall with an upright stance and there is only ever going to be one type of ball flight as standard.

I admit, i can punch a shot low for around 160 with the same club, but unless its windy and you are keeping the ball low on purpose, there is far more satisfaction in seeing a ball with a good high flight and dropping down onto the green, than a ball that does not get very high and rolls on to the green, thats if it does not get a poor bounce or go into a bunker in front of the green!

David Ferris

truthfully i hit a 7 iron 120 yards give or take a couple.

 pathetic, i know but im starting this week to do exercises to try and improve my distances because ive finished 2nd in my golf society outings the last 3 months running cutting my handicap by 6 but i keep losing by about 2 points to guys who are having about 5 or 6 dings on their card whist im maybe only having one tops. the simple fact i need to face is that because they can reach all the greens in regulation and i cannot then they can get away with more rubbish shots in between and im probably giving them a potential 10 shot head start on the 10 or so holes i cant reach in regulation. so whilst some may say distance is not that important i would have to say if your distance is as poor as mine it matters a lot.

Ben Jamin

David Hartley

didn't have the foggiest till i went for a fitting at directgolf, according to the flight scope thingie I hit my 7 old iron 140yds (MX17's).

the new MX25's i'm getting go 145.

Richard Denning

Steven James

It's a difficult one for sure as not all 7 irons are the same. They can very in degrees and shaft length which are a factor. I used to play with mizunos with tournament lofts (1-2 degrees stronger) and an inch more on the shafts. My new set are callaways and I decided not to tinker with them. The loft is 34 degrees whereas my old 7 was 32 degrees. That's half a club right away. Then as another 6ft 5 forum member suggested there is the length of the club. The longer it is, the further it will go if hit properly.

I am unsure how temperature exactly affects distance but my own estimate is 2 clubs. This means if I hit my 7 iron 140 yards now I will hit it 160 in summer. At the moment I have to take a 5 iron to hit it 160. I agree a lot of people beind the club down to deloft it and will smash it with little regard for accuracy. A pulled ball will always go further also. If a par 3 is 150 yards and you swipe it 15 yards over the back left, that does not mean you should have hit an 8 or a 9 as some people will storm into the clubhouse saying.

With regards pros, well there equipment is spot on as as their bodies and swings generally. They follow the sun where the ball goes further too. Us scots playing in minus 2 on muddy winter courses cannot be judged on a level playing field.

Accuracy is key as is hitting fairways and good chipping and putting.

Steven James

It's a difficult one for sure as not all 7 irons are the same. They can very in degrees and shaft length which are a factor. I used to play with mizunos with tournament lofts (1-2 degrees stronger) and an inch more on the shafts. My new set are callaways and I decided not to tinker with them. The loft is 34 degrees whereas my old 7 was 32 degrees. That's half a club right away. Then as another 6ft 5 forum member suggested there is the length of the club. The longer it is, the further it will go if hit properly.

I am unsure how temperature exactly affects distance but my own estimate is 2 clubs. This means if I hit my 7 iron 140 yards now I will hit it 160 in summer. At the moment I have to take a 5 iron to hit it 160. I agree a lot of people beind the club down to deloft it and will smash it with little regard for accuracy. A pulled ball will always go further also. If a par 3 is 150 yards and you swipe it 15 yards over the back left, that does not mean you should have hit an 8 or a 9 as some people will storm into the clubhouse saying.

With regards pros, well there equipment is spot on as as their bodies and swings generally. They follow the sun where the ball goes further too. Us scots playing in minus 2 on muddy winter courses cannot be judged on a level playing field.

Accuracy is key as is hitting fairways and good chipping and putting.

John Pettitt

Steven James

Jason Vickers

This post is a blast from the past.

Spring cleaning through the forums. 

Jack Smith

Lewis Gladstone-buchanan

Jack,

 Lots of people think they can regularly hit further than they can....If you can on demand hit 170-190 with accuracy with you 7 iron...well done - you are a rare breed, I wish I could.

As long as the rest of your game is going forward you should be into single figures in no time. If you are that long naturally, you should concentrate most of you practice on your short game and you will be a feared opponent.

Are you from the north or south?????

Jay Colman

8 out of ten I can hit 160+ although I play my 7 to 150 which then gives me my averages. I also use my 7 iron as my 150 marker club for distance, for example if I'm 10 yards behind the 150 marker I'll pull out a 6 iron (try to hit it then throw it in the lake)

Wayne Santorini

Stephen Falcus

Matt Simmons

150 yds straight(ish).

About 3 miles to either left or right depending on whether the dy ends with a "y"

Simon Broad

Chris Pillans

Jonny P

Darren, please do something about this post - I get emails every time someone replies - I have mentioned it several times already and I have been getting them since September 2009!!!!!

John Flood

Jonny,

You should be able to 'un-tick' the box that asks if you want a reply sent by 'editing' one of your replies

Jonny P

Thanks John - bit of a wonky way to unsubscribe, but at least it's done!

Cheers!

Rob Lilley

Robert Jess

Loud Mouth b.a.

Are there competitions for hitting a 7 iron the furthest?

I thought that short irons were about accuracy?

If one pro hits a 7 iron at 75% effort 150 yards, and another pro hits 160 yards with 90% effort what does this tell us of any significance?

Are you wild young lads thrashing balls with 7 irons?  I suppose there's no harm in it, but if so it's an odd sport. A bit like racing clapped out old bangers?

P.S. This thread is too long to read but it may have been suggested that a longer shafted iron of the same loft will hit further. If so, this does not per se always follow. What it will do though is hit further into the sky before the ball drops like a stone.

P.P.S. I've seen many a discussion thread like this before. I recall one where a chap had driven a ball 250 yards with a putter, which claim I have no reason to doubt. The question is "What conclusion should one draw from such an act?" That the hitter was super powerful does not necessarily follow.   

Wayne Santorini

2 years long this thread!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WOW

Loud Mouth b.a.

Wayne,

I tried to kill it off but you appear to have moved it into its 3rd year. 

OK let's get it going again:

"I can hit my 7 iron 110 yards. I'm the greatest 7 iron long hitter in the midlands. No-one can cap 110 yards. That's MASSIVE!"  

Wayne Santorini

Dave ley

Was it that magnificent effort that got you Remax finals in LA Ivan

Loud Mouth b.a.

Dave,

No. Simply an $800. entry fee and a belief that anything is possible. 

Only 34 old timers to beat to become a World Champion. Sounds easy doesn't it? (If only)    

David Homer

Darren Ramowski

Remeber we had the poll:

Adam Baldwin

Loud Mouth b.a.

OK guys. Let's play with your 7 iron figures and see if I can convert them into your driving distances using a 45" driver. I do not have a table for this but may be able to prepare one based on how you adjust the following estimate:

7 Iron:    180 yards

6 Iron:     190 yards

5 Iron:     200 yards

1 Iron:     240 yards

1 iron = 39.50"

5.50 extra inches x 10 yards per inch = 55 yards

7 Iron 180 yds =   Driver:  295 yards

7 Iron at 170 yards = 285 yards driver

7 Iron at 160 yards = 275 yards driver

If I get at least 10 feedback (just add your 6 iron, 7 iron, and driver distances to this thread) with not too much splay pattern then a new table may be possible.

I presently have tables for:

Which Swing Speed matches which Driving Distance? and

Which Driver Loft matches my Swing Speed?

These are available by e-mail for free if you send me your e-m address direct:

E: sanderslongdrive@yahoo.com 

*************************************

 
;           QUESTIONNAIRE:

MY 6 IRON DISTANCE IS:

MY 7 IRON DISTANCE IS:

MY DRIVER DISTANCE IS:

Chris Perry

Loud Mouth b.a.

I agree Chris. Some of these guys (whose names / driving distances appear in my little black book     - I store almost every shred of golf info.) appear to be ripping the ball with their 7 irons, but I may be wrong. So this proposed table may not be too reliable! Let's see.

I also suspect that over the years the differential between iron distances (eg. between say a 7 iron and a 6 iron) has decreased so this feedback may help me get back up to speed.  

Thuan Nguyen

12 Handicap--Playing once a week.

7-Irons-165.  If staying down & staying behind the ball, I can hit 175-185 yrs.  

David Homer

Who gives a cr*p!!! If its 170 yards in the wrong direction its no good to anyone! Mine carries about 150 and should be seen as a scoring club so accuracy is at a premium.